And how it benefits women.

Maybe some posters who defend the practice can help out.

And I'm not talking about polyamory.

Perhaps someone else will come along with something useful for you. I've been working on a post on the effect of Mo polygamy on men and women, but real life has distracted me from it.

I'm running away from home this weekend, but I'll try to finish up my post before then.

The mormon church is highly sexist almost to the point of diminishing women into baby machines and servitude to men. But the women often don't see it and say they love the church and the priestood.

Why? Because they're brainwashed and they're comfortable in a system they've grown used to.

That sums up why plyg women "like" their lot in life. They sometimes claim they like the companionship of sister wives and the close-knit community and a strong male protector. The reality is they are brainwashed.

Fear of change and hope of rewards in the sky keep them in their place, much like mainstram mormon women.

Have you watched the show Sister Wives? It helped me understand a polygamous marriage better. All the wives on the show wanted to be married to the same man and like the lifestyle.

They don't have a well defined sense of self and they NEED to feel special and part of the one true church on the face of the earth in spite of the fact that it dehumanizes as discounts them and individuals.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/21/2012 09:51PM by Cheryl.

The women are miserable except for the newest wife who is so narcissistic and clueless it's painful to watch her cram her feet in her mouth so often.

A female TBM I know has defended polygamy by pointing out how it allowed more women to obtain an education, as it pooled home duties among several different women.

Hubby couldn't help around the house?

They can do small chores around some of the houses but they have jobs and sometimes families of 50 or more people to oversee.

I know DH and I were pushed to take care of one home and two children when we both had demanding jobs and commutes.

Plyg husbands have to deal with at least double and usually many times the stress because of the huge and complicated "family" situation. Some of them give up and ignore less favored wives and their children because old long standing problems are more difficult to face than new exciting ones.

When you're in a dreary old monogamous marriage, the solitary and lonely wife has to do everything. But when you have some other sister-wives around, then one woman can watch the kids while another does the dishes. Another one can vacuum or something. That's what she said when I asked her if she was looking forward to Dad taking some extra wives in the CK.

in whatever tasks the other wives refuse to do.

He'd need to send out flyers and advertise to find ladies who want to specialize in toilet bowls, window washing, ironing, hand laundry, cleaning up vomit, and organizing garages. Sounds more like an employment office for entry level minimum wage applicants than marriage.

I think it's beyond unbelievable to assume that several wives would coincidentally all want to specialize in whatever the others did not want to do like tending six babies birthed by other women, cooking and cleaning all day while the other wives read Shakespeare or study law.

It seems like a lot to handle for one woman to babysit the children of several sister-wives. Whenever I hear about these polygamous families, the kids often number into the 20s. It seems to me that it would be even more easy for kids to play the adults off of each other than it is with only two parents.

I can't think of a single way it benefits women.

I don't think it's for us to judge. I watched most of the Sister Wives episodes and what I came away with was an understanding of their family. They are a family, they love each other, and they want to be together; living as a family. Stop judging the polygs and worry about your own life! Clearly there's a problem down in Colorado City, with teen/child brides being married off and that's a separate issue. For example, the polygs living in Utah and SL county are adults with families who love each other and want to be together.

Not too long ago people said a white and black couldn't marry. Some people say Gays and Lesbians shouldn't marry. These are adults, who are you to judge if they are doing the right thing? You say women are being used and exploited? Traditional marriages can be just as exploitive.

Seriously.

Not flaming, just asking.

You know, I have that same question. I feel like, if polygamy were to be accepted/legal, not everybody would join in. I don't really think many more would even dabble. The ones who are already accustomed to it, who have family that practice, will at least have a fair choice to grow up and be a polyg.

Some people think that making Gay marriage legal, will result in a break down in the foundation of marriage. But it won't, it doesn't.

If you're referring to the lost boys of Colorado City, Hildale area, that's a disaster in itself, and not what these polyg families are like that live scattered across the SL valley.

And which one of those is polyamory?

And how much choice do you really have when you are brainwashed your whole life into believing that you can only get to heaven if you are either:

1. A multiple wife

2. Have multiple wives

Some are much worse, others better.

Very few polygamous wives have an opportunity for higher education. They tend to marry very young and often live in very financially constricted circumstances. They are pregnant much of their lives until menopause and think it's their responsibility to bring down spirits to build the kingdom on earth. They don't think that god wants them to learn a profession.

Theorectically, they could go to classes if they practiced birth control and if their husband and sister wives supported them in it. That isn't usually the reality.

They are much less likely to have higher educations and professions than mainstream mormon women who are less likely to pursue these challenges than their nonmo counterparts.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/21/2012 05:04PM by Cheryl.

he brought home a teenaged 2nd wife younger than his own grandkids. He had several kids with her.

Does anyone seriously think that the first wife enjoyed all the extra work of raising 10 more kids that came along? Having more wives significantly raises the amount of work to be shared. And knowing your hubby is sleeping with a young girl might just raise up some resentment about it. Ya think?

Polygamy doesnt benefit anyone. Since gender birthrates are roughly always 50/50; some men could end up without even one wife.
The modern polygamists always have wives and children on public assistance, due to the costs of supporting mutiples wives and children.
Even Brigam Young couldnt financially support all his wives and children.
If a woman loves her husband she will always be jealous. If she hates him, she will feel like a woman in a cathouse randomly chosen every few days or weeks.

It does bother me when people oppose polygamy using arguments that make women sound like possessions.
For example: "Since gender birthrates are roughly always 50/50; some men could end up without even one wife." As if a wife is a commodity that should be equally distributed among men. That argument completely backfires for me, because then I start to think that the woman should have a choice, and maybe polygamy isn't so bad after all if the woman chooses it freely. Women are human beings, not property, and I don't care if not every man gets to have a wife because the whole idea of owning a wife is wrong.

Because polygamy forces them to be treated as a scarce commodity. They are kept out of sight, desexualized, and they are generally denied full human rights.

As a scarce commodity in a society full of unmarried men, they are not safe. Those unmarried men have no commitment to the community whose rules ruined their lives and become lawless as a group usually.

The impact on the community is reflected on the lives of individual women in ways we can't ignore. Sorry if the language puts you off. How would you describe it?

It's more extreme among mormon polygamists.

Not to mention polygamy creates a genetic disaster later on down. Steve benson put together a fantastic post about issues arising in colorado city etc. when everyone is a descendent of the same two dudes. It was a few weeks back.

I guess there are countless reasons why it's bad...but good? I guess only non-brainwashed consenting adults could tell you they just like it. As long as it's their choice...but then maybe it's not a great idea to have kids. Then it gets fuzzy.

And the kids have no chance of observing or mixing with anyone who has a normal one to one relationship.

The arguments seem to me the same.

I live in a town called Montreuil-sous-Bois, next door to Paris, and it is often cited as "the second largest Malian city after Bamako, the capital of Mali". That's probably a bit of an exaggeration, but there are over 6,000 Malians here, including several genuine friends, and over the 21 years I've lived here I've known all sorts, particularly women and their children via local schools which my kids have been to.

Several of my Malian friends are the fruit of Islamic polygamous marriages and, in the schools, I have seen many instances of the negative effects of polygamy.

It basically comes down to three things, in my experience :

1) The arrival of a new wife often leads to negligence or even abandonment of the existing wife or wives

2) Unless you're a REALLY high-flyer, the whole arrangement is economically unviable, particularly because of housing which, in crowded old Europe, tends to be either too small or too expensive or both...

3) The effects on the children, who see their mother discarded and yet, at the same time, see their fathers less than in monogamous relationships and often show major behavioral problems at school because of the twisted version of the father figure which that gives them.

It just can't work.

Even if 'god' ordered it, it still can't work

And the only person who gains anything from it is the husband, who gets more frequent and more varied nooky.

The cost and damage would probably be less if he just used hookers...

Luckily, for the very reasons I have cited, the rate of polygamy among Malians is falling quite quickly - mainly because of the disadvantages outlined above which are exacerbated by the conditions in Europe. About 50 per cent of my friends' fathers were polygamists. Among the younger generation (under-40s, say), there are hardly any :)

But then, in Islam, polygamy is an only option, not a prerequisite for salvation as it was/is in Mormonism.

Tom in Paris

All interesting, especially your last sentence, "In Islam, polygamy is only an option, not a prereuisite for salvation as it was/is in mormonism."

Its about fear and selfishness disguised as selflessness.

Fear of not finding a "good" man.
Fear of ending up alone.
Fear of not having someone take care of your children should something happen to you.
Etc.

Selfishness in not wanting to do some aspect of whatever is normally part of a functioning marriage. ie: Take care of Kids, Work, Not work, Paying the Bills, etc.

The man simply enjoys being a stud. Take Kody Brown of Sister Wives as an example.

The show's tag line constantly claims:

Kody: "I fell in love, then I fell in love again, then yet again and yet again." *gag* EWWWWW.

I get the distinct impression that a lot of the woman participating in polygamy are either super religious (super in that they accept the ridiculous by believing that this is what god wants them to do) or are damaged in some way emotionally that has them selling themself short in some fashion.

Polygamy is a horrible, demeaning custom that short changes everyone involved in its practice. Especially the children.

It is also doomed to fail, simply because of the way the human pysche works. Some things are meant to be shared with only one person at a time and marriage is one of those things.

To me, it is a practice that benefits only the men and their penis'. The whole idea of it being commanded is a facade. I have many translations of the bible and I cannot find a place where it is commanded, nor can I find that Abraham was told to lie to pharaoh about his wife being his sister. I do not know many individuals, male or female, that would not have a problem sharing their spouse or bf or gf. The show Sister Wives is the perfect example of a narcissistic asshole. When Meri his first wives was dealing with the fourth wife coming into the picture (younger, attractive, slimmer), Meri asked Kody how he would feel if she was giving attention to another man. He said something to the effect of "the vulgarity of the whole thought". Kody...take your hand and satisfy yourself. As crass as it sounds, I felt fortunate that my ex slept with prostitutes and did not fall in love with another woman, although at one point there was a high school girl in the picture.

Are there any known societies where a woman is married to multiple men?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/22/2012 10:19AM by tiptoes.

I think there's a tribe in the Himalayas where if the woman marries a man, she ends up marrying all his brothers. For some reason, the male birthrate is higher in this group if I remember correctly.

In some Northern Native American tribes, women could take a lover or a second husband if they wanted.

I forgot, there's also a group in China that pracitices polyandry as well.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/22/2012 10:52AM by Itzpapalotl.

Yes, I've heard of this too. My understanding is the youngest brother tends to be favored most, and this causes friction with the older brothers. I read it in a National Geographic magazine in the dentist office a few years ago.

Here is an interesting link on it I just found:

http://www.sinclair.edu/academics/lcs/departments/soc/pub/casilab/polyandry/Polyandry.pdf

The Browns.

All but Janelle were raised in Mormon fundamentalism. (polygamy).

This is not your typical marriage that both simply decided to add more wives to the mix. It is Mormon based. There are many plyg groups that vary in how they practice their form of Mormonism fundamentalism. Some groups are far worse than others. The pure bloodline (incest), are one of the most sickening.

If you are unfamiliar with Mormon fundamentalist groups, it is difficult to understand how truly damaging these cults are.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/22/2012 10:37AM by wings.

Pros:

-More women of low social status can "marry up" since men who are already married are still available. Never mind that they end up with a fraction of a husband, and all the leftover males are cast aside.

-Some mothers can pursue careers and educational opportunities while still making babies, since they can share household and child-rearing duties with wives who are happy without such opportunities. Never mind that it's perfectly possible (and less-complicated) to have an education, career, and family at the same time in a monogamous marriage.

-Women who don't like sex don't have to worry about their "wifely duties" since their sister-wives can take care of it for them. Never mind that women who do like sex only get a fraction of their husband's sex drive to satisfy their needs.

-Lower fertility among polygamous families-- actually, that has to be a legit good for society. A man who splits his seed more frequently among multiple women is going to have a lower sperm count.



And of course, I have no opinion on polyamory between consenting adults, because it's not my business to have an opinion.

It's the ultimate power trip for men who are (or want to be big shots) so they can A.) show that are big shots, and B.) believe/behave like they are a god.

As has been pretty much proven, Joseph Smith got caught screwing around and came up with the idea the God commanded all this shtupping--how convenient!

Brigham Young and his cronies had plenty of wives, and I'm sure if anyone, like a poor farmer, complained about it, he probably said "Go find your own, but if she's pretty, she's mine." Imagine the horror when reality set in for a poor immigrant (who possibly didn't speak the language) getting to Utah and discovering that if you're a man you have trouble finding even one wife or your daughter is chosen by a "leader" in TSCC and you lose her & possibly part of any kind of wealth you may brought with you (but you are told that you are truly blessed that a man of God has chosen her); perhaps if you manage to get a few wives, well, that's good, because you don't have to pay them as laborers and you can aspire to be one of the elite!

If you're a young lady you're 5,000 miles from from home and chosen by a guy with several wives--this was NOT what you were told when the missionaries promised a land of milk and honey in America. How much of that new existence was fear or brainwashing after all the promises that were supposedly straight from God I can't imagine.

I'm sure there are a few brainwashed people now that feel "God" commands it and some that want to screw several woman without feeling that they are Lothario's; either way, I think the God-complex is still at the heart of it.

So go, Raptor Jesus! Have a harem of velociraptor-ettes and parasauralopho-babes to bring forth millions of dino egg spirit babies for your new planet where puny humans are created by you--to be hunted for food!