I hope somebody can help me out with this, because it will be a major decision point if I drop my membership for good or not. I'm already inactive since several years and it's time for me to bring closure to this one way or another. I've heard they run a soup kitchen in SLC but I'm not certain. I'm guessing that other than that potential SLC soup kitchen they don't run anything else but would like to know for sure. Thanks for your input.

None that I've heard of.

Can you elaborate further how you know about this or are you just guessing ?

Because everytime a stake ships a pallet of toothbrushes to a starving child in Africa we hear about it in the church news. Since I have NEVER heard of an LDS soup kitchen, shelter, or orphanage I can only conclude that the normally self promoting church is quietly serving the actual needs of a community or doing nothing. (spoiler alert: they are doing nothing)

There are members that genuinely care about others that serve in the community, but this is in addition to the many hours of church service performed. And those programs are not LDS church sponsored programs.

Is it free for those who can't pay? Does it help members and nonmembers alike?

That's the closest thing to a mormon charitable institution that I've heard about.

Do you mean Primary Children's Hospital?

They were purchased by IHC and built Primary Children's Medical Center on U of U Health Sciences Campus. They do some amazing stuff at that place.

I saw a post from an active member on another board describing his participation in a Habitat for Humanity project that his ward just completed. He mentioned that the members contributed their labour but also their money! In short, it wasn't a church project but rather some LDS members who did it themselves. He said that the church encouraged them to do it and he gave the church credit for that!

So, let's count it all up: Members tithe 10% (most on gross income, as instructed by many bishops). Members pay another few percent (I've heard 3-5%?) for fast offerings and general missionary support. Members pay for their own children's missions (around $300/mth?). Members often pay for expenses of their callings and for some ward activities and other costs. Members pay for innumerable shower and wedding gifts for all the match-ups and baby-making that goes on everlastingly. Members pay for their own senior missions (and/or work for free).

Have I forgotten anything?

In short, Members Pay.

But no worries, the church encourages them to also labour and/or pay for any community projects going. To some members this reflects a charitable church.

Kind of incredible.

And I don't even know how they can support such a litany of giving. Marriages in young adulthood, education debt, large families, 10-15% of gross income to the church (for starters), plus one or even two missions of their own to pay for. If members could keep control of their own money and choose where to spend any that's going spare (meanwhile, paying their own way and staying out of debt and saving for the future) that would be a church that teaches and encourages fiscal responsibility and members that have a say in how the money is spent.

I don't blame you for wondering Where's the Money and being concerned about how much community giving gets done in the name of the Mormon Church through its tithes ("encouraging" members to be charitable towards the community - after their first 10-15% goes to the church - doesn't count).

For a church that apparently likes stats so much, why don't they want to say hey, we partnered with Habitat for Humanity and built 100 new homes this year. No - they don't pay for any home building but it's OK, they "encourage" their flock to do it.

I've seen a lot better programs for giving in other churches. For many people that is very important and a crucial reason why they join a church and support its programs. (I was very drawn to the giving program in my post-mo church - at all times they have helping projects going on in the town where the church is located, in the country, and in the world, so you regularly help your own community, another Canadian community, and an area of need in another country. It's an appealing concept to me).

If it's a deal-breaker for you with Mormonism, I can understand that. We'd be interested in hearing the outcome of your current reflections on the matter. Good luck!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/20/2010 08:07PM by Nightingale.

My experience is that while individual wards/members/eagle scouts sponsor community service projects, the Church does not, other than it's own welfare program and the publicized donations to world causes--the agencies I've volunteered with in SLC are independent of the TSCC.

Having said that, I was doing volunteer painting last week at a an independent shelter (they function totally on donations from businesses, cities, organizations, individuals, etc.) for those in abusive marriages in So. Salt Lake and the Director told me the LDS church does donate bedding for the visitors there....I was surprised.

I'm pretty sure the LDS church doesn't go out and buy bedding. The RS sisters get together and have a drive for bedding or make quilts. So it's pretty much the same thing discussed in the rest of this thread.

One of my "events" that lead to me leaving the church was when I was working in the mental health/social services field, I was new, didn't really know how to access resources. I had a client who was a 15-y-o female victim of sex abuse. Her family lived in extreme poverty and she was sleeping on a mattress that was chewed up, so she had stuffed blankets in the hole of the mattress. I went to the DI to talk to a manager about how to get some help from her. He sent me to the Salvation Army and said, we don't really do that.

Huh? I was blown away. What happened to "even little donations bless many nations"? I have never donated goods to the DI since. I take it to Saint Vincent De Paul where people who need help can have access without being a tithing paying, sacrament attending member.

That is, not many.

NOT.

None
Nada
Ziltch

The cult does have other charitable arms that allow it to dole out canned beans in exchange for sacrament meeting attendance. But the specific things you mention do not exist in the mormon cult.

and that does not make the Catholic Church true either. I am interested in why this would be a make or break point for you.

Would you care to elaborate?


Anagrammy

PS. The LDS sent blank white vans down to Texas and picked up donations at protestant churches on their way to Louisiana. Before they got there, they painted LDS Katrina Aid on the sides of the trucks and called up the local TV station. You may have seen the ads running... Urban myth or no? Google and find out....

Good point Annagrammy regarding the make or break. My reasoning is that even if the church were true I can't justify my membership anymore if they don't serve the poor like other charitable organizations. In fact they should outshine them by far, at least percentage wise.

where they tacked on "charitable" assistance to the poor (which choice of word happens to be the very word the IRS uses to describe one type of 501(c)3 organization, for categorizing as a non-profit.

I can tell you my own experience with such assistance. When I was fully active (and fully ignorant), my son tried to hitchhike from California to Utah. He was 16 and was stranded at a truck stop in Arizona. Naively, I called the local stake president on a weekend and asked for them to please help him get home--he had no money and was scared because he had been threatened.

I was told that nothing could be done to help on a Saturday because they needed to check first if I was a member and if I was active. I was absolutely astounded and said, "You mean you wouldn't help a child who was stranded because he was NOT a member of the Church?" They said they couldn't be running out there for every runaway that passes through. I gave them my bishop's phone number and pleaded with them to help him. I was crying for God's sake. They absolutely refused.

Now that I think about it, this was the first chink in my armor of righteous certainty that I was on God's team. I drove down to Arizona myself, 7 months pregnant, and I was like stunned the whole way. Yes, I remember thinking I should not tell anyone about this...


ANagrammy

Reminds me of a TBM relative of mine, who grew up in California and is an excellent swimmer, who refused to save my young child who started drowning at a family reunion at the beach, and retorted: "He's not my responsibility!" and refused to go in after my child and save him.

I was not there at that moment, but two other family members, who are actually afraid of the water and can't swim, were there and decided to grab my child and save him, despite their fears.

There are a few TBMs out there similar to my TBM rellie who wouldn't save a drowning child. It boggles the mind. I wanted to say to him, "So do you have a Temple recommend?" But decided never to have anything to do with said person again.

There are of course lots of TBMs I know who would not behave like my idiot rellie. So I would never say all TBMs are idiots, but some certainly are.

I don't believe there is a one true church, but helping the poor without calling a press conference does raise my estimation of other churches.

When my olest boy was 14 the Bishop decided that the Youth should start volunteering at the local soup kitchen. He said that there were other churches that volunteered regularly, and we needed to let the community know that we were here. This would be a great opportunity to get some exposure. No other reason was ever given.

So they started going once a month and it was a very good experience for them to see that homeless people were not just winos or crazy people, but families and kids just like themselves.

After a few months they stopped going, but my son and one Sister went every month for three more years. The people told him one time that they were so glad that he never tried to tell people there what church he was from, and how glad that he and the sister were willing to serve coffee (the Bishop stipulated that we would be glad to help but the kids were forbidden to serve coffee).

In YM and YW classes, the youth were congratulated on their efforts and that more people had gained a favorable impression of the church because of it.

He seemed to learn two valuable lessons- one, how much value there is in volunteering, and also how little the church cares about anything outside its own interests, like missionary work.

Some years ago, the LDS church gave a unused ward building (the neighborhood had gone downhill) in Salt Lake to the Salvation Army. They knew the SA provided soup kitchens, homeless shelters and orphanages to the down and out. Since they didn't plan on getting their own hands dirty, they used the widely announced gift for PR purposes (and a tax write-off), with lots of photos.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 12/21/2010 01:34AM by george.

The second to last ward I was in had a standing day that they took care of the soup kitchen each month.

..but, funny story, our stake youth tried to volunteer for a local Christian soup kitchen for a youth conference activity, here in the mid-west AND THEY WERE TURNED DOWN. bWAHAHAHAHAHA. The administrator said that TSCC was a "cult" and they didn't want a cult serving the folks that come to the kitchen because she knew TSCC had ulterior motives for doing so.

We had a visiting GA come a few times, and I know that very lavish and ornate meals were served in the Stake Center for the visiting GA and his party. If Jesus were visiting, he wouldn't want a lavish meal, instead, he be at the soup kitchens administering to the people who need it. I guess GA's are more important and above even Jesus, at least Joseph Smith though he was.

One of the things that started my resignation from TSSC was one evening I was in charge of a R/S activity,while clearing up the phone rang,a young man travelling from northern ireland to scotland had become stranded in our town after his ferry ran late and he missed the train,I told him to stay where he was and someone would come for him,as I did'nt drive and it was late I phoned the EQP he told me there was nothing we do in cases like this,I was almost struck dumb,I then phoned a friend who was TBM but a real humanist,he got another guy and they went together to get this chap,
The following Sunday when the EQP found out what had happened he came to apologise,I just shook my head and kept on the road to resignation,

Officially, it is zero, however they are fairly generous to supporting the local soup kitchens, shelters and even made a sizable donation to remodel an old hotel to house the homeless in apartments rather than shelter. They recently put up a sizable donation to construct a homeless shelter up in Ogden.

Of course, this is small compared to other expenditures in their business ventures, but they are involved in charitable work, just not the same way other churches or religions may be and it is definitely on a smaller scale than in could be.

Sounds exactly like what Jesus was protesting in his time. And how he was criticized for hanging out with "those" people.

Yeah, the fancy Presbyterian church I worked for was the same way. Quick with a check, but please don't have dirty people in the lobby. Have them go somewhere else. And don't let them park near the entrance, please, have them go 'round back.

And tow their asses if they are living in their car.

In Jesus name, Amen


Anagrammy

What does it matter, even if every Ward had it's own soupkitchen and free medical clinic?!

If the Church is true, it knows what it's doing because of its divine Revelator and Prophet.

And if the Church is false, no amount of soup is going to fix it. In fact, the last thing you should do is waste your concern for the poor and undefended on that bloated, money-grubbing Smithopolis.

I give my money to the local Food Bank, they give soup without the sermons.