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Posted by: dogeatdog ( )
Date: September 07, 2012 08:13PM

This guy basically advocates that the Cochranites were the influence on Mormon polygamy and that it was really never JS who had a revelation about it, but in fact others filled that in after he died because they wanted to practice it. It is really interesting. I think that it doesn't really prove JS innocent (as this guy might wish), but it really just goes toward the idea that JS used a lot of different influcences and ideas from other theories and movements and threw them into Mormonism.

Referenced here: http://puremormonism.blogspot.com/2010/06/why-im-abandoning-polygamy.html
and here is more on it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacob_Cochran



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/07/2012 08:14PM by dogeatdog.

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Posted by: Veritas ( )
Date: September 07, 2012 08:17PM

Didn't Zefram Cochrane invent the warped thought drive adopted by Mormonism?

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Posted by: John_Lyle ( )
Date: September 08, 2012 12:49PM

I think you are referring to the infinite improbability drive...

As you recall from 'First Contact' Zephram Cochran was a drunk..

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Posted by: ambivalent exmo ( )
Date: September 08, 2012 11:22PM

True. That's what I thought when I first read this post.
Hahahahahaha!!

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Posted by: Chicken'n'Backpacks ( )
Date: September 07, 2012 08:19PM

He called it Kolob Drive, but was sued over copyright issues by Intellectual Reserve, Inc....

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Posted by: Jim Huston ( )
Date: September 07, 2012 10:41PM

As early as 1818-1819 the group was talking about spiritual wivery. Jacob Cochran would assign women to the men - legal marriages were not considered valid. He would move the women from time to time - shift them between the men. It was said by one of the people that approximately 50% of the women in the group were assigned to him at one point or another.
http://www.sidneyrigdon.com/dbroadhu/NE/miscne00.htm

He used the passage in the bible about 7 women taking hold of one man to justify polygamy. In his case, polygamy was always with less than 7 women at one time.

He also was working on a commune where everything was common which is thought to be one of the incidents behind the United Order.
http://www.cesnur.org/2005/pa_miller.htm


He was on trial several times with five indictments for adultery and open and gross lewdness 1819 alone.

Here is part of the testimony of Abigail Bond from one of the trials.
>That on the sixth of December last, she went to Mr. Cochran's house in Saco, at about nine o'clock in the morning -- Cochran came out of a back room, and said Eliza Hill was sick, and wished for all


>(about twenty) to pray for her -- He went to Eliza's bed and got into bed with her, and the others began praying.


>Q. Did you see Cochrane undress himself except his linen and go into the bed, and afterwards conduct in an indecent manner.

>A. I saw him undress except his linen and go into the bed, and he put his arm round Eliza Hill, and then told the others to pray. They laid in bed about an hour, then Eliza began to praize the Lord, and both got up and walked about almost naked. He took hold of her hand and led her into another room, and came out and said Eliza Hill had taken cold by sleeping alone, and some of the brethren must go in and lodge with her.


The "Unitarian" publication tied the BoM and some of the Mormon teachings to Cochranism.

Jacob Cochran was also known as a "Mesmerizer" or hypnotist.

There were a number of conversions among the Cochranites. Enough that in 1930 7 of the 12 were in Saco, Maine for a conference with the new members.
>Shortly after the Book of Mormon was published in March 1830, Latter Day Saint missionaries began to make their way into the Boston area, where they found that making converts among the Cochranites was fruitful. So successful were they that a Church conference was held in Saco, Maine (the heart of the Cochranite area), August 21, 1835, at which nine of the newly ordained apostles were in attendance (RLDS History of the Church 1:583; Latter Day Saints' Messenger and Advocate 2 [October 1835]: 204¬207; LDS History of the Church 2:252). The LDS reference states that seven of the Twelve met in conference at Saco, Maine.


Another interesting tidbit:
>William Hyde, Cowdery and Miles had adjoining farms at Freedom. Warren A. Cowdery and William Marks were certainly acquainted before they became Mormons (along with area residents Samuel Miles, Sr., William Hyde and Lyman Wight). All of these men lived in close proximity to the Cochranites


Here is a site with the Price's book on line.
http://www.restorationbookstore.net/jsfp-index.htm

This all occurred while Smith was alive and well and in charge. The Price book makes claims as far as dates that have been proven false. Smith got "Spiritual Wivery" from the Cochranites, but incorporated it into Mormonism.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/07/2012 10:44PM by Jim Huston.

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Posted by: ambivalent exmo ( )
Date: September 07, 2012 10:50PM

Wait.
Whaaaat?
Sometimes I just cannot process the overflowing bullshit I never knew about!!!
How did I *EVER* believe in this travesty?!?!?
OMFG.
Boggles the mind........
It's like....
a bottomless cesspool of...... Evidence....
I know more now than I ever did as a tbm.....

How do the apologists swallow this and still keep on keepin' on????
Let the cognitive dissonance begin........
Un-fucking-believable.
No words will suffice.......

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Posted by: footdoc ( )
Date: September 08, 2012 09:01AM

10 dilithium reactor crystals to you!

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Posted by: ambivalent exmo ( )
Date: September 08, 2012 11:24PM


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Posted by: exrldsgirl ( )
Date: September 08, 2012 09:12AM

I read that blog post too and wasn't sure what to make of it. When I look at the differences between the LDS church and the RLDS church, I can't figure out where and when the changes happened. The RLDS church always said that any of the weird or different beliefs/practices of the LDS church were new ones they started after JS2 died and the groups split. But I think their reorganization was a pretty convenient time time drop anything they didn't like, and then to say that they had never done that.

This guy was saying basically the same thing that the RLDS church had said, which was that Brigham Young started polygamy but said Joseph Smith Jr. did it, as a way to make it seem more legitimate. But one of the things I've learned on this board is that Joseph Smith Jr.'s polygamy is one of the big secrets that most Mormons don't know about. So if JS2's polygamy was a lie to make polygamy seem better, why was it covered up later? The whole thing makes no sense to me.

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Posted by: archytas ( )
Date: September 08, 2012 11:00AM

Holy 19th century Jonestown Batman!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/08/2012 11:00AM by archytas.

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Posted by: dogeatdog ( )
Date: September 08, 2012 11:16PM

Yea, it does seem like kind of an RLDS perspective. But, my main point is just that JS clearly took ideas and theories from a lot of different sources and threw them into mormonism - they were not inspired.
Jim - thanks for that.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/08/2012 11:18PM by dogeatdog.

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Posted by: Mia ( )
Date: September 08, 2012 11:30PM

A family is only as sick as its secrets.

The Mormon religion (family) is one sick unit.

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