Well, that didn't last long. I mistakenly tried to patch things up with my TBM father after our falling out last year. He immediately started forwarded me inflammatory political emails. Then he said that he's glad that we can talk about our political differences without getting angry. I actually hadn't sent him any since we started speaking again.

So, I shrugged and forwarded him the Daily Beast article about David Twede and remarked that there had been quite a discussion on RfM about the LDS Church's apparent intention to excommunicate Twede for his political commentary about Mitt Romney and not for his years of criticism of the LDS Church. A day went by, and then Dad sent me this:

"Many people would not vote for John Kennedy because he was a Catholic. I'm appalled at your religious intolerance and that you are a part of religious hate group. You must find me to be an awful part of your life. I never knew."

I replied:

"Well, I don't even know what to say, Dad. That's just absurd, and I can't believe you would resort to such hysterics. You're better than that.

"Dissent is not intolerance, and it's not hate. Our country was founded on dissent. It's our noblest tradition, and that's why the quashing of dissent is regarded as such a cardinal sin. If people want to assemble and talk about their experiences in the Mormon church and get support from others, they have every right to do that without being labeled a "hate group." That's just ridiculous.

"Also, it worries me that you have based your whole identity on this organization such that any criticism of it feels like an attack on yourself, when I have made no such attack against you."

So, that lasted about three days.

Mormons see anything that isn't all roses and sunshine about their religion as being hate and prejudice.

It's ironic, considering all the shunning and hatred which can be thrown at ex-Mormons by them.

It's one rule for them and another for us.

I admire your willingness to engage a situation that is so highly charged. His response was absurd, but expected. Your response was both balanced and thoughtful. Kudos to you for keeping it together. Remember, you have no control over what others do, but you have complete control over your actions (and reactions). This situation is a prime example of how to not to get 'triggered' into responding in an emotional, personal way. Your response was measured and yet made the point. Nice job in exhibiting a zen like aura :)

Sorry :(

It's pretty clear with is "I'm appalled by your religious intolerance..." that he's a dish it out but not take it kinda guy.

It may be possible to have some kind of relationship with him if you were to avoid all things controversial. However, it kind of seems like the only relationship he really wants is a "yes, man" relationship. He can spew whatever he wants and you have to take it without getting angry but he only wants a one sided conversation.

Seems like a tough foundation to have a positive relationship.

I'm sorry, and you know I feel your pain. But, maybe he's onto something with that awful part of your life. ;)

I think one of the most frustrating things in life is becoming more mature than one's parents.

I get the impression that you've outgrown your dad, Makurosu.

What an asshat he is :)

+1000

Our son is currently ignoring his Dad because of "anti" information in an email from him. My DH sent him the link to the Aaronic priesthood manual where it talks about not marrying outside your race, which my son did in July. Anything that is seemingly negative about the church, even if it is two contradictory statements coming from their own website or manuals is "anti".

twojedis Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Anything that is
> seemingly negative about the church, even if it is
> two contradictory statements coming from their own
> website or manuals is "anti".

Your comment ought to be archived and presented front and center on both RfM and MT!!!

This is at the very CORE of the David Twede and mtfounder issues. The Church is one huge and very powerful crybaby that seeks revenge anyone that dares tell them, the emperor, that they have no clothes on. No different from knee jerk violent reactions from fundamentalist Islamic groups.

Awesome / I don't understand TBMs.
I'm in the same boat. I talked to my wife about caffeine and rated R movies (neither of which are explicitly forbidden anymore). I wasn't trying to chip away at her faith, I just wanted her to know it would be ok for her to watch the "King's Speech" with me.

...she got really pissed when I showed her info on lds.org (like I was secretly giving her an anti site wrapped up to look like lds.org). She actually went out and got a physical "For the Strength of Youth" manual from church the next sunday and read it (to make sure I hadn't dupped her).

I could attack TSCC, but I don't with my DW. She is an emotional being, and I know it would be pointless to show her any facts. But she still is constantly scared that I'm going to do that.

I'm sorry Makurosu.

And Makurosu's dad is a follower of an organization whose basic writings claim that God himself finds all religions other than the Mormon church to be an "abomination" and "the whore of Babylon" and the "mother of harlots."

He honors Brigham Young as a prophet, who said that all other religions were "hatched in hell."

But his church is apparently not a "hate group."

It's more of a couplet, really. McBonkie was speaking as a man. Even if he sold millions of copies via Deseret Book, a wholly owned subsidiary of the corporation of jesus.

You're just taking things out of context.. If you just stand back aways and read it standing on your head it makes perfect sense.

Oh yes, we've all been feeling the love the church has been heaping on David Twede.

Ask your dad about Muslims, or Democrats, or Gays, or one of his TBM triggers.

Then be "appalled" by his "intolerance"
lol.

I love that Mormons cry foul so much when they are so willing to dole out the hate, as long as it is to a "deserving group of miscreants"

/barf

I'm sorry things didn't go well for you. But you handled it so well, with maturity and poise. I really like what you said about dissention not being intolerance or hate. Well done.

TBMs really play the persecution card well.

Is it really wrong to be a hate group that hates an even bigger hate group?

It's for recovery, so there will obviously be negative feelings to blow away, but not hate - or at least not without significant provocation by TSCC and the lifestyle which it attempts to impose.

I'm not and have never been a mormon, but I don't hate them.

I'm frequently surprised by the strange stuff which they believe, but not hate. I am capable of disagreeing with people without hating them.

And as for Exmos : I just LUUURVE them (with mustard ;-).

Have a good week everybody

Tom in Paris



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/24/2012 05:38AM by Soft Machine.

So it's not ok to hate a pack of liars defrauding people out of their money by threatening them that bad things will happen and they won't see their families if they don't pay?

I say BS. I am not tolerant of many religions, and so is the CULT's beloved right wing politicians. Child brides and polygamy are no longer accepted despite Joseph Smith engaging in both, and practices such as honor killings and female genital mutilation are abhorrent to Westerners.

Freedom of religion extends only as far as the secular inspired social norms allow. Mormons know this and have changed many of their dogmas to satisfy the requirements of a civilized, secular society. They will again.

http://www.i4m.com/think/history/mormon_christians.htm

(Thank you, Deconstructor)



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 09/24/2012 05:56AM by steve benson.

Wow! This link is incredible!! It uses only the words of the prophets and apostles of the church to condemn the church. How you can get any more plain and concise than that, I don't know.

My dad could not refrain from sending me Rush Limbaugh-style political articles, and I support Obama. After politely asking him to stop, I blocked him on FB and told my brother that I would not take my day's calls until around Thanksgiving.

If you belong to a "religious hate group," you belong to a religion that practices hate, like Mormonism. LOL!

If you belong to a hate group that attacks religions, you belong to a "hate group that attacks religions." Duh.

Dad is also an admitted racist who frequently remarks about the tendency toward crime and immorality of black people. I haven't heard him use the N word in awhile, but it was never hard to get him to go there. I could go on and on about that.

It's Mormonism that is arguably a hate group. It empowers and enables racism, bigotry and hate, and it teaches flagrant religious intolerance. Also, I think it's Dad that finds me an awful part of his life and not the other way around. He's projecting. I wonder what he would say if I said that Mormonism is an abomination in my sight. Don't like that? Well, how does he think the members of other religions feel when that language is put in the mouth of God himself in his opening words to his prophet Smith? Oh, I guess that's different because they're wrong. Yeah, so tired of it.

as if they were like the Lutherans or Episcopalians or something.

No: when you really listen to them go on (like your father and at least half of my relatives) they are nothing but a howling rabble of ignorant racist FUNDAMENTALIST freaks!

Yes, "howling rabble of ignorant racist fundamentalist freaks." That's just about the truth.

Mak, you are an exceptionally patient although long suffering son. I don't know how you do it.

He's probably just PO'd that he didnt' get selected to be one of the elite invited to the temple site dedication next weekend so he's taking his anger out on you.

To be fair, the Ku Klux Klan was made really uncomfortable about some of the things Martin Luther King said about them. Does that make him a hater and his organization a hate group?

He was appalled, but not shocked - that's a relief. Don't worry, Makurosu. My dad is a dodo in some ways too. Just keep the conversation away from politics & religion.