. . . and, quite frankly, I'm still not sure why I am / was angry.

You see he "converted" to mormonism about a year ago. I put "converted" in quotes, because he conveniently found out what he knows about the church from his girlfriend and best friend.

For some reason he had a good life (IMHO) going, with a decent job (for an 18 year old) and opportunity to go to college. Then all of a sudden he bailed and moved in with his girlfriends family (?) . After a couple of weeks of that they saw the light (a whole nother very odd story) and he moved out to live with an RM and a psychotic jack-mormon.

Next thing I know he's deadset on becoming a missionary and full blown TBM.

I went through the whole "what did I do wrong to make him want to seek a 'gang' " thing in my head. I tried to prod him into doing his own research but he'd have none of it.

I told him that I didnt respect his decision because he didnt make it using reasoning and lining up all his options -he just went with what others told him

I can respect someone who was raised in the TSCC becuase they didnt know any better , but someone who converted at 17 / 18??!! I almost have zero pity for the day he finally comes around (if that ever happens). I almost relish the thought of saying "I told you so".

Why does this engender so much anger and resentment in me when the church is (ahem) "not so bad . . . . .?"

Has he figured out that missions aren't free yet?
Without mom & dad to at least partially bankroll it, it is not likely to happen.
This may just be a 'phase'.
Ignore the mormon bit for now and maybe just encourag him to wait on marriage/kids. If he can postpone that till his brain matures a bit he may just find his own way out.

oh he done learnt. He went on his mission in Sep. and neither mom nor dad gave him one red cent (we are divorced BTW). I think TSCC took him in as an "orphan" (cringe) and his "forever family" or something bankrolled or helped him. I caught his opening of his calling on youtube (what's up with that fad of opening your missionary letter and filming it) and he was referring to his mormon "family" as Mom and Pops. So that started yet another fight . . .

I converted when I was 18. Not having any money didn't stop me for a second. Bishop called me in and told me that there were several families who wanted me to go and were going to pay my way.

Even if no specific families had stepped forward there is a ward mission fund that they can draw from. There are many many many poor people in the church that I cannot see ever having enough money to save for their sons' missions, but that doesn't stop them either. There were plenty of Philipino missionaries who went on a mission. $400 a month is more than most families there make in total during a month.

Honestly, when have you ever heard that finances stopped a mission?

I know this may seem counter intuitive, but just hear me out.
Be supportive. Not financially, but just in a 'I am proud of u for doing what u believe in, and I sincerely hope u get out it what you are hoping too.'
Righ now he is proly trying to create his own identidy separate from his bio family and every time u give him grief for it, he will just dig in his heals.
If you tell him you gave it some thought and have come to realize that he is an adult who has the right to make his own life desisions and appologize for not being supportive of his choices you may open up a dialogue where he may eventually trust you enough to share the doubts he most certainly has and give u the opportunity to gently suggest reading up on his questions.
As long as he feels that he has to prove something and sees you as an adversarial element he will seek out praise and validation from others, ie: his church family.
I know it hurts to see our kids make desisions that will cause problems for them down the road.
The only person in this relationship that u have control over is yourself.
You can be loving and supportive of him without mentioning the church or how u feel about it (I imagine he knows your feelings on that very well by now), or you can continue to try to force him into your approved of lifestyle.
Those are your choices.
If u choose love and support, your influence over him will grow.
It has to be unconditional. If its not he will see right thru it and it will be an exercise in futility.

For the OP: I have a daughter who I took out of the lds church around the age of 8. She went back at age 20. I fought her and tried to convince her otherwise--and I have plenty of history to 'convince' her. I had to back off and let her make her own path. My son is opposite of his twin sister. It is almost as though they are both trying to be lighter and darker than each other--as though it is a contest.

They turn 27 next week . . . I do try to be as supportive as I can of both of them nowadays because the other way didn't work. I thought getting my kids through high school as a single mother was a tough job. It has only become much more difficult since they graduated as they try to figure out what they want and need out of life--and it can't be what I want for them.

You need to be the one they can come to when it all falls apart.

Oh--and my daughter--after she went back to the LDS church, started hyphenating her last name with the bishop's family's last name--since they were the ones fellowshipping her. It was very painful to me. She has stopped doing that now because my ex-SIL clued her in to the pain she was causing.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/12/2012 09:28AM by cl2.

No game-playing. You are gambling with your son's life. As a parent, you owe it to your son to be honest. Your anger is justified, because a group of cult members are LYING to your son. Also, he is being seduced by a girl, and is what we call a "hormonal convert." Mormons will use any kind of manipulation they can, to convert someone. I would certainly confront that family, and let them know who is the parent. The Mormon cult is notorious for taking over the role of parent. I have had to literally kick the Mormons out of my house, when they came in the door, against my wishes and my children's wishes, to literally drag them to some stupid activity or meeting. A couple of times, this happened on a school night, and I yelled at the men, that I am the head of this household, and that I dictate that my children are to stay home and do their homework, because in my household, school is more important than church activities. I had to say it over and over, to get them to leave. Mormon men always run in two's, and there was only me, one lone woman. Mormons are bullies. If my sons slept in on Sunday,the priesthood leaders would come into our house on Sunday morning, drag my sleeping sons out of bed, onto the floor, and force them to get dressed without a shower or combing their hair, and would Butt kick them up the stairs and into their van. The boys would be held hostage at church, while the other kids made fun of their messy appearance. What kind of church forces the members to go to meetings?

Your son is in a cult, and my heart aches for you. I am so sorry. You may have to let him go away for two years, and hope that he will come to his senses. A mission will keep him from marrying that girl, and from marrying into that family, for two years, so you will be buying some time. It will give him an opportunity to experience the secret, satanic rituals in the temple, and be treated like dirt on his mission. A mission is punishment, but it might wake him up. I hope he will continue his education after his mission. The truth is, that the mission presidents and leaders advise missionaries to get married within a year of returning from their mission.

I wish there were some kind of intervention or help for you. You can love your son, be open and honest with him, and listen, listen, listen. Surely, he has some doubts, some things that creep him out. Get him to talk to you.

((((hugs)))) I have a daughter trapped in the cult, and her children will probably be baptized into it, too. Her Mormon in-laws are very domineering. I have tried to help her, but have failed. Oh, the sorrow.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/12/2012 03:10AM by forestpal.

Thanks for your words of support.

I probably wasnt clear that he DID break up with the temptress before leaving on his mission. But he seemed to redouble his efforts to find someone to rebound with when he gets back.

There's some truth to what Sirius Lee (posted above) says also. Against all my inner turmoil I've tried at least to keep the lines of communication open with my son.

At some points I would ask him questions (the answer was ALwAYS "I dont know dad, that's just the way they do things"). But, I also let myself get too challenging at times and frustrated that would devolve into arguments.

Fortunately, right before he left, we made some sort of peace although we really couldnt discuss religion. And yet, that seems to be all his life revolves around now (well duh, now that he's on a mission)

The more I would learn about Mormonism (becuase my son became involved) the angrier I would get, until I had to back off reading and researching so much. It is almost an obsession. I do hope like you mention that I can just be there for him and let him know that when he's ready to spill the truth I'll listen. I made sure we could talk about anything, unlike the facade he gets from his goofball mormon friends and "family"

It has been VERY fascinating to watch the almost textbook like progression into a cult like mindset (if it wasnt my son, that is). One very odd instance for example . . . I told my son I was going shopping because I needed a new table beside my recliner. He kept insisting that I didnt "Need" one. It didnt occur to me until later that he was preaching materialism, I think. Very odd behaviour.

Cults tempt anyone who is in a vulnerable emotional state as your son was.

I can understand how you feel as a parent. It's difficult to accept that grown children must be free to make their own mistakes and stumbling and falling do not reflect on anything the parents have done.

I try to tell parents not to take responsibility for their grown children's successes and failures because it's they who must own their decisions and unfortunately parents can do little to intercede in the lives of other adults.

The good you did as a parent made its mark and will help in ways you'll never know. Still your child isn't you and he will have to gain his own wisdom about many things the hard way.

well its hard not to be mad when you think he has no reason for doing this. Most people feel angry when they see someone doing something that does not make any sense. Try really hard to see it from his perspective and talk with him about why he is doing it. I doubt that you're going to be able to stop him from doing what he wants to (after all he is legally an adult), but if nothing else listening to him will help you feel less angry.

I read your post last night, and thought of something that might give you hope.

Sithlord was your son, and I was the temptress. He got baptized, went on a mission, came home, and we got married. We've been married 23 years, nearly, and we left the church together last summer.

All hope is not lost. The best thing you can do is to drop the subject of religion with your son. Support him, love him, and build your relationship with him. Sithlord's Mom wasn't happy about him joining the church. She was angry when he decided to serve a mission. Once she stated her opinions, she didn't feel the need to constantly dig at our religion. She was always respectful and kind, never bringing up our beliefs.

Now that we have left the church, the relationship is strong, and undamaged, largely because of the choices she made, and the wise way she handled the situation. It must have been heartbreaking for her, but she is a great example of how you can feel one way, yet choose to act another.

I am writing this from the perspective of 10 years later.......

My DD anounced she wanted to convert at age 16. We refused permission (oh, evil parents!) and insisted that she do her homework. At 18 the decision would be hers. She did read a lot of the material we gave her, but somehow managed to dismiss it all away as irrelevant because the spirit told her "the church is true". She threatened to move in with her friend's very TBM family because they "understood" and supported her.

The subject died down for awhile and we thought maybe we had dodged the bullet. But then she went to college and the Mormons redoubled their efforts. She got baptised but didn't tell us for several months. We told her that we would always love her but that we strongly disagreed with her choice. At first, she would make comments like "I don't know where I'd be without the church." REALLY? Do you think you'd be living under the viaduct turning tricks to support your heroin habit? Don't be absurd.

For various reasons, I think she would have eventually left but then she met her future husband. They got married in an LDS temple (another story) two years later.

It has been a struggle but we have managed to keep a positive relationship, but that has required absolutely no comment on all things Mormon. We just don't bring it up. That may seem phony, but we have accepted her decision and having our children (and grandchildren) in our lives is more important than being right about Mormonism. Here is the payoff: they come to my house for the holidays, I am the first person she calls for advice, we go on vacations together and have a great time.

It helps that they are pretty 'liberal' Mormons. I have my coffee stash at their house, they have no problem with us ordering a drink with dinner, and they don't preach or get all sefl-righteous (usually).

Anyway, my advice is to set your boundaries, be firm in your opinion, but continue to love your son. The acceptance he finds in Mormonism is contingent on remaining a faithful member. Don't make your love and acceptance contingent on his leaving TSCC. Don't burn that bridge. A high percentage of converts eventually leave the church and he may need that bridge to return back to sanity someday.

It's hard not be mad at him for making this decision and it's hard to watch someone you love exploited and manipulated. Steve Hassan has a saying: "People don't join cults, cults recruit people." Cults target people at vulnerable times and when they are in a transitional state. Your son was recruited. He was deceived. He was vulnerable and they exploited that.

Good luck.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/12/2012 11:00AM by caedmon.