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Posted by: janeeliot ( )
Date: February 12, 2013 07:44PM

I was rather paying attention when Pope Benedict XVI was appointed -- and I was disappointed. There had been some speculation the choice might be a nod to the Catholic Church moving into an age we might recognize as modern, a nod to reproductive rights (which the majority of Catholics practice no matter what their church says), and a nod to the huge Catholic Church outside the European tradition. Some thought a South American might win the vote. I said at the time, "Couldn't they do better than a former Nazi! Seriously."

Obviously none of that happened, and I thought the world and the CC the poorer for it.

Benedict's reign was marred by scandal -- not just the ongoing problem of a cover-up of the pedophilia, but also some financial irregularity that have not been fully explored.


I know all this, so please do not try to educate me (although thanks so much for thinking of me). All that said, I have found a lot of the response to this pope's resignation not just snarky and snide, but mean spirited and childish. It makes me feel as though I am trapped in some 19th century Know Nothing meeting where rabid anti-Catholicism is running riot and everyone -- but me -- is secretly hoping it will end with us routing the local Catholic out of bed for a good old-fashioned lynching.

I happen to have a lot of Catholic friends. Over nine out of ten have left, and not one of them is unthinkingly uncritical of the religion of her youth -- and not one of them can be less than offended by some of the stuff I have read on Facebook, other post Mormon sites, and here. Someone out there in cyberspace -- not naming any names -- said nothing he said about the pontiff could be disrepectful because there was nothing to respect. In what world is that not disrespectful? It was spoken like someone from small town Utah -- or Idaho -- who had never lived outside of Zion, never had so much as a minute of education after high school, and never actually -- you know -- met anyone Catholic -- an uninformed, closed-minded -- well -- still basically Mormon guy -- no matter for how long -- or how loudly -- he has been gone from the rolls.

My friends who were raised Catholic have much sharper, more cogent criticism of Catholicism than those of anyone I have had the pleasure of reading here. They also -- all of them -- have pieces of their upbringing they respect and value. They value the quality of their Catholic education -- which beats that of Utah's public schools cold. There was something they loved along the way -- the message of charity, the poetry, the music, the ritual, the lessons in symbolism -- but it seems to me, above all, the habit of respect, the large lesson that someone need not be perfect to command your respect, and as none of us are perfect, and we as we all need respect, it's a good human lesson.

If I tried to say what I envy in my Catholic friends, it would be a large humanity and an acceptance, even a pleasure, in the mixed bag of being human, a realization that life really isn't black and white, that no one is perfect and need not even try, you can embrace your failures, you can be a flawed human -- a message sorely lacking in Mormonism.

And sorely lacking in a lot of the disappointing response to the Pope resignation. If it isn't black and white, then you can't say this pope is all black, can you -- unless you are still an immature, black-and-white Mormon thinker. And isn't the rabid anti-Catholicism one of the uglier birthmarks of the Mormon Church? Why would you want to cling to that piece of nastiness? It is not as politically incorrect as keeping alive that hideous anti-colored skin thing?

I have not perused every thread, but has anyone mentioned that there is something very good in the resignation? Of course if Benedict XVI had stayed on growing more gaga by the day you could have made fun of that, too. Wasn't that one of Steve Benson's tip-offs that the Mormon Church was not all it claimed? That it hung his grandfather out to dry while he painfully faltered, failed, and died? Shouldn't we cheer that a guy somewhere had the courage to say "Enough," and maybe, just maybe set a precedent of people -- even heads of churches -- retiring when they can no longer do the job?

I am also posting not just for the sanity and integrity of the thing, but to stand with my Catholic friends, lapsed though they may be. As a pro-choice woman, I value the support of Catholics for Choice. (I also find them intelligent, nuanced thinkers, people with plenty of guts, brains, and soul.) But it has always seemed to me that support is -- or at least should be -- a two-way street. As CfC stood by me when I needed them, I will stand by them. And while they might have their own reasons to quarrel with Benedict XVI, they do it with respect, maturity, and understanding that is sorely lacking in many of these posts.

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Posted by: citizen not logged in ( )
Date: February 12, 2013 08:16PM

Interesting--thanks for posting. I remain unconvinced as to the long-term value of religion. But at least someone is finding something of worth in it. I attended a Catholic high school, although I was a rabid TBM at the time... My education was good, but my overall experience was not. Same with my education at BYU.

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Posted by: Leah ( )
Date: February 12, 2013 09:08PM

This pope is in his 80s and he wears a pacemaker, he must know his days are numbered.
I wouldn't be a bit surprised if he had a near death experience.

Wanting to retire to that lovely monastery and live out his life in prayer as a monk is a good decision imo.

The cardinal from Sao Paulo,Brazil looks like a vibrant choice for next pope.
But that's just my opinion.

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Posted by: robertb ( )
Date: February 12, 2013 09:15PM

janeeliot Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

>
> I have not perused every thread, but has anyone
> mentioned that there is something very good in the
> resignation? Of course if Benedict XVI had stayed
> on growing more gaga by the day you could have
> made fun of that, too. Wasn't that one of Steve
> Benson's tip-offs that the Mormon Church was not
> all it claimed? That it hung his grandfather out
> to dry while he painfully faltered, failed, and
> died? Shouldn't we cheer that a guy somewhere had
> the courage to say "Enough," and maybe, just maybe
> set a precedent of people -- even heads of
> churches -- retiring when they can no longer do
> the job?

I made a comment to that effect. Until there is evidence otherwise, I am taking the Pope's reasons at face value. I did find some humor in the fact he made the announcement in Latin. I'm not quite sure why it strikes me as funny.
>
> I am also posting not just for the sanity and
> integrity of the thing, but to stand with my
> Catholic friends, lapsed though they may be. As a
> pro-choice woman, I value the support of Catholics
> for Choice. (I also find them intelligent, nuanced
> thinkers, people with plenty of guts, brains, and
> soul.) But it has always seemed to me that support
> is -- or at least should be -- a two-way street.
> As CfC stood by me when I needed them, I will
> stand by them. And while they might have their own
> reasons to quarrel with Benedict XVI, they do it
> with respect, maturity, and understanding that is
> sorely lacking in many of these posts.

American Catholics in particular often think what they want and give the Vatican grief. A friend of mine was happy to be a "cafeteria Catholic" and he and his wife were wonderful people. He was very supportive as I was leaving Mormonism.

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Posted by: jacob ( )
Date: February 12, 2013 10:05PM

I'm not sure what you want, you post something saying some "posters" were rude. Do you want an apology?


I want to address your criticism but I can't find any real criticism except that "posters" acted like rude, naughty, uneducated, Utahns who have never had a coherent thought in their insignificant life.

At the end you mention that Ratzinger is showing some resolve in not making Catholics around the world suffer the same way ETB made Mormons suffer. Were that the only reason that would indeed be admirable. My question is why is he the first of 266 Popes to have the magnanimous idea, and if he isn't the first to have the thought why is he the first to act on it? There were some pretty good men before him that held on to the last breath.

No something stinks about this and given Ratzinger's history it could be any number of unknown issues. The man is quite obviously old and infirm, I don't question that that is one of the reasons that he will not be Pope at the end of the month. I just wonder if his infirmities have made it increasingly difficult to be the Rottweiler of the Catholic Church, or has his status as Rottweiler caught up with him?

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Posted by: bona dea ( )
Date: February 13, 2013 01:19AM

Good post, jane. Like everyone else, the pope is neither all good or all bad. I too read the comment you referenced. It was on another site, Jacob, BTW and I found it appalling. In fact that post and others like it is why I no longer go to that particular site.I am no fan of Benedict, but that does not mean he is evil. It simply means I disagree with some of his conservativee stances and with the way he handled the abuse scandal.

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