Dance card interviews are conducted by bishops, and the cards get signed by the kid, the bishop and the kid's parents.

Last night, my kid wants to go with Mormon friends to a dance. Fine by me, but he needs a dance card. His friends arrange an interview with the bish, and arrange to stop back at home so I can sign his card on the way to the dance.

I get a call at 9pm. My kid says, "bishop signed on the parent line. Can I stay at. The dance?"

For me, I don't care if my kid has a dance card or not. But for the bish to sign on my line...pretty dishonest. He should hand over his temple recommend.

On the other hand, my kid who is not Mormon was honest enough to get my permission to stay at the dance when there was the slightest hint of impropriety. So, never-mo kids out-truths a Mormon bishop.

why does he need a dance card to go to the dance anyway?
He is with a mormon friend right? When did they start this?

Some areas use the dance cards as a way to let the kids and parents know the rules of the dance (dressing appropriately-no mini skirts, no sagged pants, no bare midriffs, etc-, no suggestive dancing, no alcohol/tobacco, etc., all rules we had to follow at our school dances in high school anyway). The teen signs the card saying they will abide by the rules and if they choose not to the parents will be contacted. They have the parent sign saying they know the rules as well. The bishop signs the card when he's gone over the rules with the teen. That's all the interview is (or should be), going over the dance rules. It's not a worthiness interview, it is just going over expectation for conduct so no one can pull the "I didn't know wearing a see-through shirt wasn't allowed" card, or anything of the sort.

The bishop shouldn't have just assumed it would be okay to bypass getting the parent's signature, but I doubt it was done maliciously or with the intention of circumventing the parent's authority.

Why would a nonMormon need a dance card? Did you just subject your kid to some Mormon worthiness interview? He had your permission to go to this dance whether there was some card or not, but signing for you seems entirely inappropriate, especially in light of the fact that Mormons are more than happy to lie and bypass parental permission of non's and ex's if it suits them. I would be worried.

I'm going to chime in here. The comment that mormon leaders could care less about parental authority of nonmos is absolutely true. It is for that very reason I (a nevermo) became familiar with this board.

Let the bishop know he may never speak to your child again without you there, and under no uncertain terms may he EVER assume your authority again. Try your hardest to intimidate him, ESPECIALLY if you are a woman.

I'm serious. Don't let this slide, no matter how minor it may seem. And good on you and DS for his respect toward you in asking if he could stay.

I believe... in some jurisdictions... signing someone else's name is a serious infraction (named a 'gross misdemeanor' or Felony in WA), regardless of intent/effect.

Im guessing here.. but I think in most the intent/effect matters more, as in signing a contract, a check or other negotiable instrument.

just sayin'



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/17/2013 03:05PM by guynoirprivateeye.

So what was going through the bishop's mind? Was he doing an end run around you so that they can convert your child?

This is really stupid and I agree that the bishop really stepped out of his jurisdiction.

However...can I ask what a dance card is? I was BIC and when I went to youth dances we never had one nor did any of my non-mormon friends I dragged with me. Is this new? Or a Utah thing?

one more piece in the Mormon "Control Puzzle", that's what they are.

In our stake, the kids have to basically go in for a temple recommend interview to go to dances. If they wanted to take a non mormon friend, the friend also had to go through an interview.

They are then issued cards so they can get into the dance. No card, no dance.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/17/2013 04:15PM by Mia.

"Billy, have you ever kissed a girl at a dance?"

"What is your reason for wanting to go to a dance?"

"Does your friend practice chastity?"

"Do you have a girlfriend?"

"Have you necked and petted?"


What a fuggin CULT.

Big Brother at it's finest........

breedumyung Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "Billy, have you ever kissed a girl at a dance?"
1. That's not something you have any business asking or knowing.
>
> "What is your reason for wanting to go to a
> dance?"
2. Duh... what do YOU think?
>
> "Does your friend practice chastity?"
> 3. What? Does practicing piano count?
> "Do you have a girlfriend?"
4. Why do you want to know? You're too old for her.
>
> "Have you necked and petted?"
5. My neck moves just fine, and My dog loves it when I pet her.
>
>
> What a fuggin CULT.
>
> Big Brother at it's finest........

Clarification question: Did the bish sign HIS name on the parent signature line or forge YOUR name?

His name.

Not a big deal.

I think you may have more to worry about than the Bish forging your name.

DID THE BISHOP ASK YOUR NON-MEMBER SON IF HE MASTURBATES?!

Seriously.

My kids know better than to tolerate that question. They have been told that I will call the police if there is a question of a sexual nature. They also have my permission to ask the bish if he masturbates, or if his wife gets him off by hand.

My kids are not repressed...lol...they just have good friends who are lds and want to go to dances sometimes.

This is the first time I've heard of any such dance card business. Dat cray yo. Like there isn't a dozen eagle eye adults watching the dance floor for the slightest human contact anyway. The ultra monitoring of everything is sooooooo crazy.

When I was a teen in the 60's, the LDS church had lots of dances (Gold & Green Ball, anyone?). They did not require any kind of interview/permission at all! Why would you? Just have a few chaperones, sheesh.

I would absolutely contact the stake president and report this.

If the bishop will sign as a parent, what else will he do? He needs to be called out.

Since I don't recognize the authority of the bish or the sp, I will contact neither.

I just thought the audacity was over the top.

It is. It assumes and presumes a lot. You can of course do as you like.

I would not allow a church official or a teacher, neighbor or friend, to sign the parent line of any form or card relating to my child. Not without my knowledge and approval and not without advanced notice to me as to why, when and how it was being done.

The problem isn't you not recognizing their authority over you, it's that they don't recognize YOUR authority over your own child, it seems. As a parent, that would be a HUGE problem for me. Religious in tone, or related to religion or church, or not.

If my good friend did this, or my sister, without even telling me up front or first, even if her intentions after the fact appeared not to be malicious according to her or not negative, according to others, I'd still feel the need to bring it up to her. I'd say, hey, I see you signed off on this card for my child, that I've never seen before, here on the parent line. What's up with that? What's it mean? Was I supposed to see this and agree to something and sign there, instead?

At the very least I'd get it across to them that this was a one-off, one time thing as any form or card requiring a parental signature would, in future, be signed by me.

It need not be a negative or angry confrontation, or accusatory in tone.

Kudos to your kid, for noticing and informing you of it, and seeing the need to check in with you about it. It seemed "off" or wrong to them, so they sought your ok and approval before continuing. Good for them. And you. You raised a smart, good kid.

Did your son call at his instance or did the bishop suggest it?

He was invited by friends to a dance. 1st time this year...needed a dance card.

So, it was his friends idea and he followed through. That he called before he went into the dance is indicative of his own honesty, even when the bish was willing to lie.

I think the bish was just trying to save time, and make it easier for my kid to go to the dance without coming home for a signature. He told my son that I would not mind...that's the part that kills me...how dare he pretend to know my mind.

He is an ass hole.

My son made it right by checking with me. I could not be prouder, though simultaneously, I'm pissed at the bish.

Oh ... that is so ... must control my temper ....

So not okay. I wish I could say I can't believe it, but sadly, I do.

Since a Mormon dance card is not a legally recognized document, I don't see this as a Felony or even a misdemeanor.

Signing on the wrong line is common for any document. Haven't you ever done it? It only becomes a legal issue where one signs another's name without permission on a document with intent to deceive. Letters, for example, are often signed by someone else who has been given authority to sign. I have letter signed by "Calvin Coolidge" dated January 20, 1921 to my grandfather. Looking carefully one can see it was not actually signed by silent Cal, but by a secretary.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/24/2014 02:12PM by rhgc.

Since when did they start requiring a parents signature?

When we attended if you did not have a dance card they would take you into a room as a group and tell you the rules and give you a dance card right then and there.

If he did it to make it easier for your child to attend then he was not being a stickler for the rules and just wanted your child to have a good time.

My cousin and I sneaked into a TSCC dance wearing Levis. We were promptly kicked out but demanded our money back (a dollar each I think). They refunded our entrance fee which we had never paid. I'm quite proud of that young rebellious act.

I really think everyone is getting a little too excited about this. First of all, you allowed your kid to go to the dance. Of all the crazy things teenagers can do these days, going to a Mormon dance is a pretty good choice.
Second, it's pretty much a Stake by Stake decision to even have dance cards or not, along with what the dress code will be for the dance.
Third, I have given dance card interviews and they are definitely not anything close to what has been mentioned here, and they are not temple recommend interviews. It's basically a meeting to make sure they understand the dress code and rules of the dance. That's it.
Forth, if you don't recognize the church, the bishop of the card then who even cares who signed what and where. The important thing is to know where your kids are and what they are doing. It sounds like that is the relationship you have with your kid.

Sorry about the typo above.
Forth, if you don't recognize the church, the bishop *or the card then who even cares who signed what and where. The important thing is to know where your kids are and what they are doing. It sounds like that is the relationship you have with your kid.

Is it possible that the bishop's glasses or vision isn't that great and he simply signed on the wrong line?

Either way, I don't see a big deal.

Props, to your kid for calling and letting you know that the bishop signed on the wrong line.

I hope he had fun and found a cute mormon girl that was repressed enough to make out that night.

The Mormon church is a racist, sexist, homophobic cult. It mistreats minor mormon children who attend and also their nonmormon friends who visit.

It's obvious that this incident tends to prove my point about keeping kids away from Mormon indoctrination. The Mormon overreach on parental rights is rampant and unacceptable.

I don't like seeing Mormon bishops have their way with Mormon kids and parents, but nonmos don't have the excuse of being brainwashed and under their thumb.

A couple of thoughts on this one:

1. The bishop is the "father" of the ward. They assume this role over all members of not just the ward, but believe they are the spiritual leader of the entire ward boundaries, mo and no-mo alike. There are many accounts of leaders assuming this role and excluding the biological parents. These are God's spiritual children after all.

2. Control, control, control. Cult, cult, cult.

3. This is a sales program and having a mechanism to counsel and guide the youth of his community is just another step in their commitment pattern for missionary opportunities. They want to "build relationships of trust" to break down the barriers and get ready for the commitment. Get them to commit to small things in advance of larger things.

4. They are scared and don't want to deal with unknowns showing up to a dance with a pocket full of drugs. See also #2 above. This allows them to pre-screen and deny at the door without much conflict. It reminds me of government red tape or multiple levels of defense.

5. I would, and have, advise my children to avoid that cult building at all cost. You might have to offer up some other competing activity to satisfy their social needs.

6. On the surface, it is probably harmless, but as a whole is part of a larger ideology and cult mindset.

you need bishop's permission to go to a dance now? Kids can no longer just wander in off the street and witness how good Mormons have it? Great missionary tool.

"Dance Card" = red flag card!... for member and free people alike.

When did this pasttime come into being? Does anyone have a copy-scan-wordage? sherriebaby49 & somnambulist make some good points here.

Bob, this is great! - "They also have my permission to ask the bish if he masturbates, or if his wife gets him off by hand."

bookratt spell it out nicely.
Good story fakemoroni.
Phazer - "I hope he had fun and found a cute mormon girl that was repressed enough to make out that night." - GREAT.

(How does Mormonism spell liability?) With it's "do as I say, not as I do" theory, policy, and practice(s).

The church fears you and doesn't think about why one fears it. It thinks it is perfect - that is a problem. It wants to know everything about you while, at the same time, fearing you might learn a few (scary-anything) things about itself.

Next, you will need a "looking at Mormonism" card... even if, in reality, you are looking right through it.

M@t