Tom is a deep, consistent thinker, as well as a methodical, powerful writer. (I also like the fact that he writes long. Heh).

Tom and I were fellow Tempe, AZ, ward members/ward missionaries (under his stout direction until we both eventually made our bolt from the Cult).

"Darkfem's" post on Tom and his book resulted in Tom responding to its subequent thread on RfM, which prompted me to ask Admin to pass along to Tom my contact info.

Here's "Darkfem's" original post, with its accompanying now-closed thread:

http://exmormon.org/phorum/read.php?2,862491,862491#msg-862491


This afternoon, I found an email from Tom in my in-basket, which read:

"Steve--

"How great to cross paths again, even if in cyberspace. Reading your words on the blog brought back a flood of good memories with you (and a few embarrassing-but-true memories about me).

"Thanks for your kind words on the blog.

"As for the book, I tried to reach you a couple of times . . . when the book was published to get caught up and offer you a copy, but to no avail. So I have a . . . book . . . for you if you'd like one. . . .

"I'd be honored if you read it. But more than that, I'd just like to talk again to reconnect and get caught-up if you're willing. . . .

"Hope all is going well.

"As Always,

"Tom"
_____


My reply:

"Tom--

"I looked you up on Google Images. Ex-Mormonism appears to have been good to you.

"I'd love to get hold of your book and maybe even read it! Would you mind getting Kerry Shirts to co-sign it? :) . . .

"In the meantime, I'll try calling you in order to reconnect. . . .

"Steve"

*****


Thanks again to both "Darkfem" and Admin!



Edited 7 time(s). Last edit at 04/17/2013 09:06PM by steve benson.

That was a fun and productive thread.

And, many of us are getting books :)

I can't wait to discuss it here. Maybe Tom Riskas will participate, too.

. . . of Mormonism, including fielding questions and focusing on issues related to his deconstruction of Mormonism as he has presented it in his book.

Tom Riskas is a thoughtful, intelligent guy who knows Mormonism inside and out--and who can cogently explain why he once was inside and now is out.

I think it would be a rich and informative experience.

Tom wanted me to pass on his willingness to engage in an affirming dialogue here with RfMers--newbies, lurkers, ex-Mormons and those transitioning out. I would suggest that folks here take him up on his offer. He said he is looking forward to the opportunity to open things up on this board.

It was great to catch up and reconnect with him.

Thanks, "Darkfem"!



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 04/17/2013 10:21PM by steve benson.

In my experience, once the "wolves of disbelief take hold" (as Kai Nielsen writes of me in his Foreword to my book) the terms "inactive" and "possibly agnostic" become equivalent to "almost pregnant."

For a theist this means, I think, that eventually he or she will acknowledge the return to the state of natural Atheism we are all born to. It's just a matter of time. As I see it, and have personally experienced it, there is no authentic return to faith. There is only a desperate clinging to a belief in an elusive, ever changing belief of the impossible, made possible by the perverse belief that anything is possible.

Once the real doubt that fuels faith -- and I suspect apologetic defenders of the faith as well -- is acknowledged, the stubborn, desperate denial and self-deception motivated by fear, guilt, existential anxiety and the related nostalgic yearnings for certainties that don't exist will eventually lose their power, leaving the "inactive" believer inactive, and the "active" doubter a "Holmesless Watson."

I don't know Kerry (though I would like to), but he seems, on the basis of his review of my book, to have intellectual integrity. I hope he joins in the thread after you all have a chance to do the reading, if you choose to. Either way, I truly look forward to joining as well to benefit from your stories, thoughts, experiences and reactions.

Please let me know if and when that happens so I can join in.

Thanks!

I'd like to get a copy of his book. This was the first I'd heard about it.

Amazon link:

http://www.amazon.com/Deconstructing-Mormonism-Analysis-Assessment-Mormon/dp/1578840074/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1366079521&sr=1-1&keywords=Thomas+riskas
_____


Shirts review:

http://www.amazon.com/review/R1UTQ25BP7RKMT/ref=cm_cr_dp_cmt/176-9632853-6550553?ie=UTF8&ASIN=1578840074&nodeID=283155&store=books#wasThisHelpful
_____


P.S.: Tom told me there will be copies available for folks here on RfM, as it goes into a second prirting.



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 04/17/2013 10:57PM by steve benson.

Long, long ago I exchanged words with Kerry Shirts on a long dead board when I was newly exMo-ifying myself.

To have an apologist who thought they had heard "every trick in the book" turn must have been something powerful.

FYI - Based on Darkfem's Riskas post, Kerry's review, and my old days reading all thing apologetics, I sent Kerry an email. Surprisingly, he responded. He calls himself "inactive," and possibly "agnostic" (his words). And definitely struggling with religion. At least he realizes that the apologists are barking up the wrong tree.

Any interest in having me see if he's interested in joining in with Tom on rfm?

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/18/2013 12:13AM by steve benson.

In my experience, once the "wolves of disbelief take hold" (as Kai Nielsen writes of me in his Foreword to my book) the terms "inactive" and "possibly agnostic" become equivalent to "almost pregnant."

For a theist this means, I think, that eventually he or she will acknowledge the return to the state of natural Atheism we are all born to. It's just a matter of time. As I see it, and have personally experienced it, there is no authentic return to faith. There is only a desperate clinging to a belief in an elusive, ever changing belief of the impossible, made possible by the perverse belief that anything is possible.

Once the real doubt that fuels faith -- and I suspect apologetic defenders of the faith as well -- is acknowledged, the stubborn, desperate denial and self-deception motivated by fear, guilt, existential anxiety and the related nostalgic yearnings for certainties that don't exist will eventually lose their power, leaving the "inactive" believer inactive, and the "active" doubter a "Holmesless Watson."

I don't know Kerry (though I would like to), but he seems, on the basis of his review of my book, to have intellectual integrity. I hope he joins in the thread after you all have a chance to do the reading, if you choose to. Either way, I truly look forward to joining as well to benefit from your stories, thoughts, experiences and reactions.

Please let me know if and when that happens so I can join in.

Thanks!

I would love to read your book. I knew of it, but couldn't get a copy of it. I'm glad to hear it's going to be printed again. Hopefully I don't miss out this time.

I also look forward to any conversations you and Kerry may have on this board. It's always fascinating to me to hear how people arrive at their conclusions about Mormonism. Especially when they decide it's not what they thought it was.

Please let us know when it come out in print.

Currently I'm reading "Book of Mormon Book of Lies" by Meredith Ray Sheets. This book murders the source of mormonism. Your book Tom, would murder the theology that sprang from mormonism.

I'd really like a copy as well. Please keep us posted on the second printing.

Thank you for sharing your book and insight, tomriskas. Thanks for visiting RfM.

I have met Shirts briefly many years ago. He was a pleasant and friendly guy. My impression of him is that he was not an intellectual academic type- formally educated in areas that create disciplined thinkers. His apologetics were lightweight and unconvincing, IMO. He struck me as a magical thinker, shifting in and out of magical thinking when it came to cause and effect relationships.

He seemed creative and intelligent to me. I wonder if, given enough reading, he has self educated himself to the point he now understands standards for credible evidence and sound argument.

I commend him because he has come a long way if what he wrote is true. He has been very creative in defending the church. He seemed emotionally invested in supernatural answers to me.

Kudos to him for continuing his quest and continuing to study. Study and incorporation of new information often requires us to change our views. I know I've had to adjust my views to match the facts several times.

I too experienced the "wolves of disbelief." At some point, I just couldn't keep pretending "God did it" was a useful answer for anything.

Thanks to Steve for helping us "meet" the author.

Shirts' amazon review was so full of breathy exclamations about his inability to "take on" Riskas, it sounded like it was composed in an emotional fugue. Maybe it was. That's interesting in and of itself.

I'll be very interested in hearing his comments when he is able to articulate a more substantive, engaged response.

IMPORTANT NOTICE RE: BOOK MAILING

PLEASE GET THE WORD OUT TO THOSE YOU THINK MIGHT TRULY BE INTERESTED IN READING THE BOOK. I STILL HAVE SEVERAL BOOKS LEFT. FIRST COME FIRST SERVE.

I just sent an email to those who have contacted me by email so far to request a complimentary copy of my book.

TO THOSE WHO HAVE NOT EMAILED ME AND WANT THE BOOK, here's what I'd ask you to do to get the book:

1. Please send me aN email with your full name and mailing address and zip so I can mail the book to you. (Please send it in the format of my name and address below, apart from any reply message you might choose to add, if any.)

2. Please send a check tomorrow, if possible, or as soon as possible, in the amount of $8.00 for shipping and handling so I can cover my out of pocket cost.

Send the check to:

Thomas Riskas
9030 W. Sahara Ave. #462
Las Vegas, NV 89117

I will send the books tomorrow USPS to the name and address I get from you.

I will send another email when the book is actually mailed, and would appreciate an email confirming you have mailed the check.

Thanks.

Tom

Thanks Tom! Excellent!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/18/2013 10:57PM by shakinthedust.

I just sent you a book copy reservation to the
RCG e-mail address.

Just in case you don't get that, I've included my
postal mailing address with the $8 payment sent today.

Thanks for the offer,
Uncle Dale