2 days after we sent in our resignation letters, we got a visit from our former BP and SP stopped by to fix a little oversight on our part (apparently they need BOTH parents' signatures for a minor to resign). But while he was here, the SP felt compelled one more time to bear his testimony of the 3 witnesses.

During the conversation (which he dominated - BP only said about 10 words the entire time and looked like he didn't want to be here) the SP decided it would be a good idea to make an announcement in RS and EQ that we had our names removed so that everyone would stop wondering where we were.

So we have found out through an innocuous Facebook post that our former SP is having a special combined RS/MP meeting this Sunday in our former ward (odd for a 4th Sunday). We're thinking it's about us, and we're curious as to what will be said.

Does anyone living in the Ogden area (DonQuijote, darksided?) want to be a spy for us? Normally I wouldn't be asking people to go to church, but . . .



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/24/2013 05:45PM by utahstateagnostics.

Depending on how you want to handle it, I would e-mail the Bishop and Stake President with something like the following:

Dear SP and BP:

It has come to my attention that you intend to make my resignation a public matter. I see this as a violation of ecclesiastical confidentiality. There does not seem to be any good reason for you to to make this public other than an attempt to label us as outcasts in the community. This also seems contrary to the church guidelines which state that such things are handled between the member and his or her Bishop. Something between me and my Bishop does not usually include informing the whole Ward.

All that being said. If you still feel the need to inform everyone of my resignation from the church, please let me know what date you plan on announcing this. I would like to attend at that time to give my side of the story, I wouldn't want anyone to be left with any question as to why I won't be attending going forward and I'm sure many people will have questions and I'll be on hand to provide answers.

If I find out that you have made the announcement when I wasn't there, I will simply show up the following week between meetings to answer any questions that the ward members may have. I may decide to contact local media. You may be aware that there was a recent NY Times article of a high ranking church member who has left the church and they may want to provide a local angle on the story.

Please let me know of your decision as soon as it's convenient.

There was a legal case where a member resigned but the local bishop instead announced he had been excommunicated and why. He sued for defamation. You might mention the case I think it's Norman Hancock - and warn of legal action if they defame you. I would volunteer to go spy but live too far away.

It was Marian Guinn who had his "excommunication" announced publicly in church by a leader. The problem was that he previously had tried to resign, had this right denied, and was subsequently excommunicated.
Normal Hancock was also "excommunicated" after he resigned and also filed suit against ldsc, based on the previous Guinn case.
And here's a link: http://www.mormonnomore.com/legal-precedent

So utahstateagnostics, if you've resigned and your BP announced that you were excommunicated or defames you in any way, then you've got precedent for some legal action. But also, as Finally Free! said, the BP doesn't really have any good reason as to why this needs to be announced. It even goes against church guidelines (see the CHI).
And sorry, I'm waaay to far away to volunteer as a spy, sorry!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/24/2013 07:18PM by msp.

I actually don't mind him announcing it. It would save us the trouble of explaining to everyone one at a time that we left.

What I'm worried about is the possible badmouthing. I would go, except that he might not say what he would normally say.

with no bad mouthing. Such a thing could never happen.

Exactly. Bad mouthing is going to happen with a public announcement, it will cause rumors to be spread.

His excuse "So members won't worry where you've gone" is just silly. They don't make a practice of announcing every church member move (unless they want help from the Elders quorum). They also don't make a habit of announcing every time someone goes inactive. People stop attending all the time for all kinds of reasons.

The reason he wants to announce it is to:
1. declare open season for love bombing to those members inclined to do so.
2. declare an unofficial shun of you... Wouldn't want the other members finding out what you've found out.

His public announcement may be perfectly polite and respectful, but the rumors will start before the next speaker stands up. "Why did they announce this?" "What did they do to leave?" "They were such nice people too!" "Well, I've always known there was something wrong with them!" "They just want to sin" "I'll be keeping my kids away from their house from now on." "Are they OK, I'll bake some brownies and see if they need anything" "Who offended them?"

If you can, stop it. If you want to tell people thats fine, it would be on your terms, with the people you care to know, not this way.

I live in Layton, obviously!!!, I wouldn't be opposed to helping...

If you're serious email me at joakes79 at gmail dawt com for the details. Thanks.

EDIT: Wife just noticed that I forgot the numbers in my email address. Now it's correct.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/27/2013 01:38AM by utahstateagnostics.

RECORD IT!!!

"Do not discuss my personal business or my resignation in your church meetings. I don't want to be forced to take legal action against you and your organization."

What exactly is it about this religion that makes them act so bratty.

well MORmONISM was started by a brat, and his brat cohorts, who then picked out other brats and elevated them to MORmON leadershi-t positions with in his bratty religion.


Somehow even today, MORmONISM still has appeal to people who are real MORmONS and very bratty about it.

how else would anyone find these ass clowns to be inspiring.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2CiyrZd-kB0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jMqTMZxCowE

Absolutely Record it!

Then transcribe and tell the world, or prepare a lawsuit, or put it up on YouTube.

EDIT: This was a reply to Bite Me. I don't know why my comment didn't post accurately. Is there a bug in RFM's software?

SECOND EDIT: I live 800-900 miles away. I don't want to come to Utah. BUT, if I were there I'd go for you in a nanosecond. I'd return with a recording.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 07/27/2013 12:02AM by jiminycricket.

but it may well have something to do with preventing people from resigning (hello, hastening the work of salvation) and your name could be mentioned, especially since the SP seems to think that's cool.

What's to stop you and your spouse from showing up, if you're that curious?

I don't even know how to go to church anymore. It's been 22+ years since I've been except for one funeral. Plus I have no church clothes and I don't want any of those idiots following me home :)

let the shunning begin!

Did you have any close friends in your Branch? If so maybe you can ask them what the lesson was about.