I'm so frustrated right now. My wife is threatening to leave me. She hasn't cited my leaving the LDS church as the reason, but it's a huge factor. Today a female friend of mine sent me a text message. It was innocent, basically she was telling me that she was bored at work and wanted to start a conversation via text/e-mail. My wife knows this woman and is friends with her. But for some reason, my wife was really upset that I was texting this woman while my wife was at work.
I'm to the point where I think I might just eat some humble pie and go back to the LDS church just to make my wife happy. Yeah, I know that's major codependent right there. I don't want to lose my kids in a divorce and I know that would happen. She would restrict my access to my kids as much as she would be able to.
I'm really stuck here, can someone offer some advice or suggestions? I wrote my Pastor for advice too. Should I go back to the Morg?

From your other posts, you seem to have jumped into born-again Christianity and expressed some concern for the eternal salvation of Mormons. Such concern would only exist if you truly believed they were going to hell.

A relationship where the two individuals involved truly believe that the others' respective Invisible Man In the Sky (TM) is sentencing them to damnation is not a healthy one.

So, don't go back to make her happy. I'd also recommend you take a close look at whether or not 'biblical' Christianity -- and all the misogyny and genocide it has historically encompassed -- is really any better.

In any case, were I to make a recommendation (and it's worth every cent you're paying for it), would be to back off the newfound religion and just stay home. Give not only her but yourself time to process your exit and closely evaluate what paradigm you are using to make your decisions.

I can see where you'd think I jumped into born-again Christianity. I've had experiences with them dating back to the late 1980s. I guess what's hard for me is trying to believe that there's nothing after this life. I like the concept of salvation being a free gift that you simply have to accept and not something you have to work for by reading scriptures, going to the temple, paying tithing, etc.

I can appreciate the sentiment; I too like the thought of a peaceful afterlife.

But there's a big chasm to cross from "Salvation is a free gift" to "Mormons go to hell." I imagine it's the latter sentiment, not the former, that troubles your wife.

In any case, from her point of view, her worldview has entirely shifted. From where she stands, you may appear to be making decisions in haste, hence my recommendation to slow down.

Both of you at this point are using a decision-making paradigm grounded entirely on emotion. Your first stop when encountering marital difficulties was to hop onto RfM (which can be considered hostile) and to write your pastor (who is not an objective observer).

If you want to keep your marriage intact, put the brakes on the changes. Ask your wife to see a therapist -- a secular therapist -- together. Figure out whether religion is going to be a wedge issue, because at the moment, both of you have set it up to be.

Subject matter aside, which is pretty tragic with kids. Good luck with that my friend. But...(no offence or insult meant)
Given an on-going thread on "what underpants should I wear"? And your a "colleague was clearly trying to start an affair" dialogue, perhaps there is a need for a post-lds life skills thread?

No.

back away from the new contact/relationship.Slow down. Think things through. Impulsive decisions could return to posteriorly bite you. GOOD LUCK

No

Out of interest, why would you lose kids in a divorce?

IMO, it depends. If you are going to return to Mormonism, play dumb, support the church out of fear of your wife - then no. If it's a strategic move to keep you close to your children so you can lead them out some day and/or if you think you can slowly chip away at your wife's testimony and rescue her, then maybe discretion is the better part of valor. I took leaving pretty slowly - I would have been out immediately if I'd been single. But I had to leave a little at a time because I wanted to guide my family to come along with me. Now we are all out, although DH professes some belief he doesn't pay tithing or attend or object to doing fun stuff on Sunday. He's starting to think about some of the things and see the light. But it's taken TIME.

If you see that kind of hope for your family, maybe the long term plan will work better for you and going back, on your terms, could be effective. If you are just being bullied, you need to think a lot about it because you are going to resent being whipped sooner or later. Good luck. It's a hard decision.

If I do go back, I'm going to be a Ninja putting ideas in peoples' heads that cause them to doubt TSCC.

nice!

No....if your marriage is valid in her eyes only if you're active in the church again...it's not on very solid or logical ground...kinda like a guy I know who's wife went vegan and told him if he wants to live with her he has to also...and he look like $hit...needs to eat a steak or something...

Ron Burr



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/09/2013 08:15PM by Lethbridge Reprobate.

Did you ever see the movie When Harry Met Sally? The premise is that men and women can't just be friends because sex gets in the way.

I'm guessing your problem isn't as much about religion as it is that you are entertaining your wife's friend. Not cool.

You can go back to the Morg, but if you continue to chat via E-mail or facebook, or twitter with women other than your wife.

You will probably have a pissed off wife.

Yeah, that's my other step. No more female friends. I've seen that movie and I remember what Billy Crystal's character said. I honestly have no feelings for this lady friend, she's a cool ex-FLDS lady, that's all.

No.

No matter how hard you try, if you aren't TBM your frustration will show. Then she will accuse you of moping around just to punish her for forcing the issue.
What she really wants is for you to really want to go back. She probably thinks you are ignoring the spirit and if you just really tried, you'd believe. Can you accomplish
those kinds of mental gymnastics? Do you even want to?

You shouldn't have to give up your freedom of thought for your spouse.
If she won't stand by you to hell and back, she doesn't deserve to have your love.
"He left the church" is like "I caught him looking at porn." A way for a woman to divorce in the church without losing face. Could she be provoking you to an impulsive break up so she won't have to be the one to do the dirty deed of walking out?

Nobody is obligated to do things that violate their values just to please their spouse. It is wrong of her to ask. If she wants to stay married to you she needs to talk to you, understand and value YOU...not the cult. She needs to work on it with you and maybe a sensible, non-religiously affiliated counselor.

The freakout over the coworker text is a sign on insecurity. Perhaps she thinks you rejoining is insurance against losing you to someone younger or thinner or with whatever it is she feels she lacks. She obviously doesn't know her church history, that it was founded by an adulterer for the sake of adultery.

In any case it sounds like a wretched situation for you and you have my sympathy. If I were you, I'd make every effort to nurture your relationship and make her feel secure that she's your one&only--except for the going Mormon again. All relationships gotta have boundaries, and it is ok for you to keep that one.

Hello BWB,

Sorry to hear that you are having such problems, it is NOT easy is it?

First of all, good decision to back off from the friend. I beleive you when you say she is just a friend, but as your wife is obviously feeling very vulnerable right now, it is not worth your marriage.

As for the 'go back to church to keep your wife and kids', I feel there are WORSE reasons to go back to Church. But how long could you keep it up? It is now against all your beleifs and to sit through Church and feel combustible about what is being taught, will probably be very destructive to you. Also how honest are you being not only with yourself but with your wife to do so? I think very quickly you would resent her for 'controlling' you to the degree she would be if you did go back, and that resentment would be fatal to a marriage.

If you feel you can and that is the only way you can save your marriage, then I say the motivation is NOT wrong. I actually ToTALLY commend your desire to stay with your family no matter what. However I would not expect your marriage to last past the raising of your children. I made similar decisions in my marriage (to stay in in for the kids, despite onging continual adultery on my husbands part). The marriage lasted another ten years, but ended VERY badly, and ironically I took the blame for the breakup .... Go FIGURE!!!

I would TOTALLY consider marriage counselling, I feel it may be your only hope of saving your marriage at this point, and being able to maintain a feeling of inner integrity yourself. Compromise is a new and very difficult concept for mormons and some other religions, but if you and your wife can reach agreement on how to handle things in your marriage (change the goalposts so to speak), you may be able to have a happy marriage still. Sometimes learning about the other person in change can lead to greater intimacy between a couple, but BOTH must be plugged in.

Good luck, I really feel for you, and my thought are with you in this!

PS I just read the bit where you said that you would go around trying to put doubts into others heads. DON"T do that, whatever you do, because your wife will pick it up STRAIGHT away and accuse you of not being sincere, (and she would be RIGHT!!). I truly do not see how you can go back to Church feeling as you do, so please get some counselling and try to come to a compromise.

Divorce is a big step. First off - you do not lose your kids. You split your time with them. You still get to see them and support them.

I also think you have jumped from the frying pan into the fire with your new beliefs. Goof Grief, they seem as weird as Mormonism.

Perhaps you should slow down and take some time to figure all this out.

I strongly suggest marriage counseling; there are far deeper problems in your marriage.

My marriage counselor was very active LDS but was fantastic. I learned more about myself than I thought possible. Among other things, it made me realize that I wasn't the crazy one and it gave me the courage to get divorced.

I also strongly suggest talking to a lawyer now and learning your rights. A nice trick is to talk to the top half dozen divorce lawyers in your town (then they can't legally represent her.)

Finally, cut out the texting nonsense. Sorry, but that is innapropriate to do behind your wife's back and could be very bad for you in the long run (especially since the woman knows your wife--her loyalties may not be what you think they are.)

I think having a text relationship with another female is never as innocent as you think it. What if your wife was texting a male co-worker? As for going to church with her, is that something you care to make a lifetime commitment of!

I agree that marriage counseling is a really, really good idea. Maybe also some individual counseling for you both? It helps to be able to talk to someone without anything else in the way. I'd also make sure you get a counselor who has no religious bias.

Yeah, I'd stop texting/emailing other women, as it clearly makes your wife uncomfortable. But I don't buy into the whole men and women can't be just friends nonsense. I have a few really close guy friends who are absolutely platonic. One of them is like a brother to me, and I'm like a sister to him. My husband is totally fine with it. He has some female friends. I don't mind. Friendships shouldn't be constricted by gender. True, loyal friends are rare enough as it is.

I believe that nothing you can do will "make your wife happy." You can only make yourself happy. I would ask yourself, "what do I honestly, truly want?" And then have the courage to act on that.

Also, nothing she, or the church, or a court of law might do will ever prevent you from being a father. You may have stumbling blocks on the way, but who doesn't? Love your kids and love yourself.

And no, I would not go back to a religion that is based on lies.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/10/2013 12:33PM by PapaKen.

If my husband was texting women or a woman, I would have a problem with it.

Maybe that doesn't seem right or fair, but i'm just telling you the truth. If you continue to do that you will have some huge marriage problems.

Stop doing that. You'll see that i'm right.

Let her leave then...if her love is conditional....its not a marriage of love its a structure for her and a prison for u....nobody has the right to control someone's mind thoughts and beliefs...its not easy to stand up for yourself when the family could crumble...but it wouldn't be all YOUR fault...and you have the right to decide such things for yourself...otherwise...you'll live out a marriage of resentment and order...and wonder where the love went ten years down the road...

I would give marriage counseling a try (from a non-LDS counselor.) You and your wife need to sort out your differences with the help of a disinterested (but professional) third party.

I would also quit texting your friend.

Good luck to you. Please let us know how the situation develops.