My Mom and her husband are trying to sue me for grandparent visitation. I used to have them watch my daughter, they are Mormon. They were brainwashing my daughter, having her pray 3 times a day, and many other rituals. In addition to this I had been trying to resolve, with my Mom, memories that I'd blocked out for years of my Mom abusing me and leaving me with an abuser. With my Mom and her husband forcing their religion on my daughter, and my Mom denying the memories of my childhood and stunting my ability to heal from this trauma, not to mention breaking down trust, I decided to not to have them watch my daughter anymore. They live in Utah. I moved out of Utah. Now they are suing me for grandparent visitation. I'm a single parent, I make very little money, I don't receive child support, or any social services, and I can't afford a lawyer. Now that I've taken our lives into our own hands and taken control from my parents, they hate me. I think they would rather see me dead or in prison than happily raising my daughter free of religion. They have turned my family against me and have choked out any support system I may have had. I dislike that this battle has to be fought in a utah court. I don't want to be told by the court that I have to let them see my daughter, they will turn her against me. Suggestions? advice? anyone been through something similar?

ACLU

Are you divorced? If so then did you have an agreement on religion as part of the divorce. If so I would think it has to be respected even if a grandparent would get visitation. Another option would be to tell the judge your issue and then say but I will allow then to visit in a public place with me present. Just a thought. Might be a nice compromise....and help the judge out a bit. You could tough it out for your child to see your mom even tho she is awful.

Do you have a law school in your area? Law students often volunteer in free clinics offering legal advice. Best of luck to you.

+1, you are asking for legal advice. You need to educate yourself quickly on the legal resources in your area. I don't want to be critical, but you really need to own the outcome of this one yourself.

This is not for forum posters such as myself.

Get legal counsel, if you can't afford legal counsel, ask legal counsel what resources are available in your area to help you get legal counsel. Avoid working with Mormons even if they are professionals or work with the government, if they are TBM, they will be loyal to Mormonism.

Fight this, win this!

I agree, call or visit social services in the state where you now reside. They will be able to refer you to an attorney(s) that can work with you based on your income. Some of them may even do it for free. Also, you can look in the phone book for 'Legal Aid'. BUT, Social services will be the best place to start. I know that you do not want to go to social services, or get them involved, but ya know what? At this point you have NO choice. The grandparents have forced you to seek legal help. Don't feel guilty for seeking their assistance. This is what YOUR taxes pay for, now it is time for you as a taxpayer to use social services. That is what they are there for, and they see this sort of thing all the time.

Wow. Hard to believe they could get court-ordered visitation when their own child has custody. I've seen it happen when a parent of the non-custodial parent has sued. They may just be trying to intimidate you knowing you don't have the resources to get a lawyer who will tell their attorney to suck it.

But that being said, it is Utah. By whatever reason they have standing in Utah, I have seen the weirdest things happen there when it comes to family court pitting cult and non-cult members. So don't put anything past them. Look for legal resources and stand up to them.

I'm looking for people who've had similar situations, and for suggestions towards resources. The legal help in my area won't touch it b/c it's in Utah so I'm limited to what is available by phone in utah. Also, if anyone knows a non-mormon family lawyer in utah, I'm looking into every avenue to get extra money for a lawyer. I also appreciate your support and positive thoughts. Thank you.

You said you aren't in Utah.

I think fomoali is saying that she's looking for a lawyer in Utah who's willing to work with her (while she's in whatever state she's in), via the phone since she's not in Utah.

fomoali - Sorry I have no advice about the legal stuff but I applaud you for protecting yourself and daughter. Good going!

I doubt they have a strong case, your's seems stronger for denied visits. Pushing a religious agenda, history of abuse, denial of abuse, get a lawyer... I will be worth it for the sanity it creates.

http://grandparents.about.com/od/Grandparents-Rights/a/Family-Disputes.htm

You get what you pay for. I believe you are leaving out some of the story because You said you do not live in Utah. How does Utah have a legal right to make you go to Utah?

The next thing is that Grandparents really have no rights and if they are your parents, then they have none. If they were the fathers parents and he was dead then there would be some standing in his place.

What State are you in? There are lots of attorneys on this board and each State has different laws.

Whether grandparents should have rights is moot. Legally, in many, if not most, states they do have right to sue for visitation. The basis for this is that custody and visitation is based on the best interest of the child and being in contact with extended family generally satisfies that.

I am a grandparent. When my oldest daughter divorced, if the whole thing had gone sideways (I can't conceive of how it would, but you never know) I would have sued for visitation and would have expected her soon-to-be-former MIL to do so as well (and I would have supported her--she's a good woman.)

How would they force you to give visitation rights if you don't even live in the same State?

What are they going to do if they win. Send the Utah state patrol across state lines.?

Yea, I can't imagine a parent being forced to send a child over state lines.

My sister went through this with her in laws who were also religious nut cases though not LDS. Essentially she told her husband that it was her and the kids or his parents, make up your mind. He wisely chose the former though he was free to contact them himself and visit if he wished. The poop hit the fan, and she almost had to have a restraining order taken against these freaks...they said she was an unfit mother and they were going to take her kids away. Fast forward ten years or so and bro in law in finally terminally ill after having leukemia for 13 years of the 20 he was married to my sister. He planned and paid for his own funeral, specifically telling his parents to stay the hell away...they got lippy and said they would attend if they wanted....so the funeral home was told to throw them out as trespassing if they showed, call the cops if necessary. They wisely chose to hold their own memorial in their home town, only his brother who was a bone marrow and stem cell donor was allowed to attend. Once M was dead the harassment really started..phone calls to the kids,all minors at the time, behind her back. My sister was adamant that the kids were to hang up or let all calls go to the voice mail. She also made clear that when they were 18 they were more than welcome to have a relationship with their late father's freaky family but not before then. To the best of my knowledge they wisely chose to stay the hell away though their uncle was at my niece's wedding last summer.Stand your ground against your hateful, spiteful oh so righteous Mom and her hubbie.

Not a lawyer, but you wrote you had them watch your daughter. Just looking at "common sense" and depending on how many hours per week they watched her, and how old your daughter is, they "might" try to make a case that they were so involved in her life that your taking her away and cutting off contact is not in her best interest. Definitely get legal help.

I have been in your shoes! I was sued for grandparents visitation by my TBM ex-mil. The laws vary from state to state. There is a private group on facebook that is a support group for people that have gone through this. You can email me: way.of.the.thistle@gmail.com and I can give you more information.

If you have been living with your child in another state for over six months they may have to file suit in your home state, being the state the child resides in.

http://grandparents.about.com/od/Grandparents-Rights/f/Jurisdiction_in_Grandparent_Visitation.htm

Sorry folks, but Utah does have a grandparents visitation statute. It's ill-conceived in my professional opinion, but it exists. And the question is not where she lives...it's how long she has live there. If it's recent (within 6 months or so) Utah could potentially still have jurisdiction over the child. This is to prevent parental child kidnaping (not that that's what OP is doing--I completely sympathize with her plight).

The point is, this is a very serious and possibly legit lawsuit. She needs competent counsel to represent her.

But she and the child do not live in Utah.

I would think the parents can only sue you in the state you live now, before a verdict comes down you can always move to another state.

Don't leave a forwarding address.

Unless your parents are extremely rich, they will not be able to afford this legal hassle.

Sad situation to have your own parents go against you.
After this blows over, cut them out of your life completely.

I didn't leave a forwarding address either when I moved, but I still got "found". Keep in mind that anyone can be found on the internet by access to public records, and public "info" sites like spokeo.com it sucks cause my mom has an unpublished phone #, BUT it is available on spokeo . Don't want to freak anyone out, but she needs to be aware of the fact that anyone can find anyone.

fomoali Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> My Mom and her husband are trying to sue me for
> grandparent visitation. I used to have them watch
> my daughter, they are Mormon. They were
> brainwashing my daughter, having her pray 3 times
> a day, and many other rituals. In addition to this
> I had been trying to resolve, with my Mom,
> memories that I'd blocked out for years of my Mom
> abusing me and leaving me with an abuser. With my
> Mom and her husband forcing their religion on my
> daughter, and my Mom denying the memories of my
> childhood and stunting my ability to heal from
> this trauma, not to mention breaking down trust, I
> decided to not to have them watch my daughter
> anymore. They live in Utah. I moved out of Utah.
> Now they are suing me for grandparent visitation.
> I'm a single parent, I make very little money, I
> don't receive child support, or any social
> services, and I can't afford a lawyer. Now that
> I've taken our lives into our own hands and taken
> control from my parents, they hate me. I think
> they would rather see me dead or in prison than
> happily raising my daughter free of religion. They
> have turned my family against me and have choked
> out any support system I may have had. I dislike
> that this battle has to be fought in a utah court.
> I don't want to be told by the court that I have
> to let them see my daughter, they will turn her
> against me. Suggestions? advice? anyone been
> through something similar?

There are free legal clinics in utah for people who are being brought to family court but cannot afford representation. Go to the utah family court website and see when the next one is. You can get actual lawyers to help you answer your question.

Family court is a gamble, and they really hate when people waste their time with petty drama. I think you will be okay.

You committed no crime.
If you live out of state they will have to find you first. Just move to another street.

DO NOT leave a forwarding address with the post office and go to a new cell phone.

Close Facebook and any other sites.
And do not contact anyone else in the family.

It's doubtful your parents will have the resources to keep chasing you across state lines.

I had forgotten that the facebook group has a web site. It's full of information that you will find helpful. Google: coalition for the restoration of parental rights. It should be the first site that comes up.

They would need to serve you with papers in your current state of residence. I would think your current state's regs would apply, not Utah.
A competent parent has the right to limit visitation of their children. See the attached Supreme Court decision, Troxel v Granville
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troxel_v._Granville

These are my suggestions.

Remember: People go into crazy-making when they sue you!!

Go into protection mode.
They are going to track you down, possibly get a detective to follow you around check up on everything they can find out about you. You'd be amazed at what is out there! Pay attention to vehicles in your neighborhood. Know who they belong to. Know if there are strange vehicles showing up where you are at.

Get well informed about laws in your state and laws in Utah.
Find some kind of legal aid that is free of nearly free.

Screen your calls. Don't answer the door unless you know who is there and they have a reason to be there at your request.

Remember there are cameras almost everywhere you go: shopping, getting gas, etc.

Keep a record of dates of everything involving the grandparents, when they took care of the child, etc. Document all of the mistreatment you suffered, when and where and by whom.

You can make it difficult for them to find you but it involves moving, maybe getting a room someplace.
Start using throw away cell phones, using a PO box in another city for bills etc. Change banks/credit union. Keep copies of everything in a safe deposit box. If they can get ahold of your tax info they can find you. If they know your employment they can often get info about you that way. (They are not supposed to give it out, but some do.)

Where is the father in all of this? Why haven't you gone to court to get an order for child support? You will need to do that also.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/10/2013 01:08AM by SusieQ#1.

Is this even a thing???! I have never heard of legal grandparent visitation. crazy!

Being a former resident of UT, I remember a case similar to yours. The grandparents were trying for custody of a kid(s)...In the paper it said that the courts verdict was that under Utah law, grandparents do NOT have any rights to their grandchild. It was in the Standard Examiner in Ogden, UT.

Not a lawyer.

But the state of Utah cannot compel you to return when you already live in another state.
People have the right to move - and to disappear if they so desire.

Your parents are deliberately harassing you. I bet they were a bitch to grow up under.

Stay out of Utah!
Your parents would have to start procedures in each new state, probably in each new county, you move into.

You are correct, this is more about control.. than actually interest in the well being of your daughter. You have set boundaries and they won't have it.

I'm so sorry your parents are still abusing you. That's shameful!

Be strong and take care.

Don't fight it in Utah court.
Since you already moved, they or Utah can't make you come back.

Just disappear from off their radar.

If they find you, move to another address and your parents will have to start all over again.
NEVER sign for a registered letter or anything else.

After a year or two, they will either run out of money or lose interest.
If not, the longer you drag this out the less of a case they will have.

This is very similar to businesses who have creditors.
Instead of fighting them in court, smart businesses simply close their doors.
Thereafter, creditors will have to find the owners, try to serve them, and good luck with that.