So I have been investigating the church for almost a year now. During the beginning I was convinced that the message of Mormonism was what I had been looking for, but since discovering some of the ugly aspects of the faith (thank you primarily to websites like this and Mormonthink) I am not wanting to be a Mormon. Please, to all who are members in this forum don't take this personally. I do like your church, but I am discovering that your church has a difficult time with telling the complete story (again, no offense).

Long story short, I commited to baptism on August 31st. I don't want to do it. I'm happy staying friends with all the elders and sisters that I have met but I don't think I could ever be a Mormon. Not after what I have discovered.

So how do I tell them? How do I tell my would-be bishop whom I have befriended? Any ideas?

Thank you for your help!

It is probably worth adding that I committed once before but pulled out. This is my second date to commit to baptism.

A part of me just figures I could do it and then never go back. There's no harm in letting the missionaries feel that they've "succeeded." No harm, no foul, right!?!

Yes, I suppose you could do that. However, it might be a very useful thing to say 'No, I do not want to be a Mormon. I don't want to be baptized.' It'll exercise the 'standing up for yourself muscles, if you see what I mean. It's an important life skill.

Whatever you decide to do, congratulations on seeing through the smoke and mirrors and BS! :-)

Since you are asking, but may I clarify what is your objective and can you give me a sense as to why you are unsure how to take control of the situation as to your baptism. Is this an issue in other parts of your life or unique to this situation?

If it were me, and it is not, so needs to be customized based on your answers.


"I do not want to be baptized and I do not want to join your Church. I do not believe the doctrines and I am against some of your key principles. Because of this it would be very inappropriate for me to join your organization."

Depending on Response.

"I am so glad you respect my decision, I am glad we can remain friends, I've enjoyed getting to know you and believe we can be friends with different beliefs."

Or

"I am so disappointed you responded that way. I really had come to believe that we were becoming friends with a mutual interest in _________________. It seems clear that your interest was primarily in my joining the Mormon Church. Since I will never be getting baptized are you still my friend?"



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/21/2013 02:36AM by gentlestrength.

And pleasers can often please themselves into all sorts of things they don't want to do -- or shouldn't.

Just say, "No."

"No, I'm not going to be baptized."

"No. I don't want to be baptized."

"No. I should never have committed."

Do not give any other reasons, or you will open yourself up to further arguments and manipulations. You will have to say "No" about 30-40 times, so be prepared for that, and keep repeating "No' like a broken record.

Remember, Mormons are professionally trained "close the deal," and they are relentless. They never give up. You even might have to give up their friendship, for a while, because they will threaten you with not being there for you anymore. They will threaten you with outer darkness, loss of friends, loneliness, ill health (when I was too sick to go to meetings, my bishop said I would get sicker if I didn't attend) threaten with loss of income if you don't pay tithing, financial ruin, eternal separation from your family--be prepared for all of it!

Since you know this will be a real battle, with the Mormons outnumbering and out-manipulating you, get some family members, friends or a clergyman to stand by you. Tell them of your situation, and have them there with you, when you tell the missionaries, and on each follow-up visit, if necessary. I'm sorry to break the news, but you are dealing with a cult.

Have courage! Congratulations for seeing through the lies. Please return and report.

I'm a huge wuss when it comes to that kind of confrontation, when I know I'm going to be bullied... so I usually just ignore the person(s) and it generally works.

In this case, I think it would work... just ignore them. Dont answer the phone or the door. Or you can call them and quickly tell them you are cancelling, and hang up and THEN start the ignoring.

It reminds me, how I cancelled my baptism 4 days before the event. I don`t have any missionary friends after I left the LDS Church. It seems that they were my friends only because they wanted to baptize me.

I think you should say that you are not ready for the baptism yet.

Quote: "I think you should say that you are not ready for the baptism yet."

Definitely don't chose such a way to tell them, it keeps you in the same situation and just postpone it for a bit.
You have to be clear, concise, simple and firm.

I remember that before I was baptized I had to have an interview where they asked me 1) If I believed Joseph Smith was a prophet 2) If I believed the Book of Mormon was true 3) If I believed the current prophet was a prophet of God.

If you haven't already gone thru this interview you just answer "No" to one or all of those and they should not baptize you. If you have already gone thru that interview let them know you have changed your mind about all or at least one of those questions.

Unless things have changed a lot in the process of getting baptized, that should do the trick. Oh, and by the way, Joseph Smith was never a prophet, the Book of Mormon is pure fiction, and Thomas S. Monson in no more a prophet of God than I am. So it should be pretty easy to let them know that you are not ready to be baptized until you can say "yes" to all those questions. If they still want to baptized you then I really don't know what to tell you except RUN FOR THE EXIT! They're desperate for a warm body.

As far as being friends with the missionaries that taught you, whether you get baptized or not, the current set of missionaries that are in your area will both be reassigned to other areas within a few months and you will likely never see them again. It's actually against their rules to contact you by mail, email, or by phone once theyre transferred. Now, once their mission is over they can contact you but then they're hundreds of miles away and they will be busy with college or getting married way too young and having kids immediately because the church has counseled them to. I baptized a couple dozen people on my mission and there's only one family I really have kept in contact with and mostly just through fb. Don't join a church you don't beleive in because of a friendship that will likely never be more than a long distance facebook friendship in the long run.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/21/2013 03:41AM by coolelder.

Tell them you do not want to be baptized and found out about the chanting and secret handshakes in the temple when they ask why. They aren't allowed to discuss the temple endowment ceremony so they will probably be caught off guard and hopefully not give you too much grief.

If they say there are not secret handshakes and chanting in the temple tell them right away you are ending the conversation because they are LYING to you and you do not believe it's right to lie or keep the disclosure of things like that from someone before they join a religion, especially one that demands 10% of their income.

If you're not familiar with the secret handshakes and chanting let me know and I'll post some links for you to check out.

Also, over almost a year of investigating I'm guessing you have made it through a good amount of missionaries because of zone transfers. Statistically a few of them are probably already sort of disillusioned as it is and don't completely believe everything they're selling about the mormon church and don't want to be on their missions. Those ones will just end up happy eventually they didn't fool one more innocent person into joining and they would probably be the most likely to keep up a friendship with you if you wanted to stay in touch.

the missionaries won't believe you or leave you alone if you apologetically tell them you've changed your mind.

You'll need to stand up to them and firmly say the words, "I'm just not interested in joining your church. I appreciate the time you've spent with me, but I will not be baptized."

You can say this while they stand on your porch. No need to invite them in. And it would be a big mistake to explain why you're not interested because they have canned answers for every objection.

They're likely to return more than once so you'll need to repeat your little speech several times before they will give up. Still, they might return occasionally for months before they give up.

Don't feel too bad about their feelings. This happens to them all of the time and they're used to the rejection.

You don't owe them anything. They are salesmen with a bad product and your first job is to protect your own interests as you would if someone wanted you to buy a non-existent bridge.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/21/2013 05:35AM by Cheryl.

Mormonism is like smoking. Better to never start than become addicted and try and quit later.

Tell the missionaries you can't commit 100%, and you're not interested in secret handshakes and magic underwear. Mormons can't talk about the temple ceremonies. If you talk about such things, they might be uncomfortable and might leave you alone. Besides, being a convert and getting married in the temple would mean you're family would have to wait outside with all the other "unworthy" people.

First, this is a forum that is intended to meet the needs of those who are ex-Mormons or who are questioning the faith. So you are among friends here.

When you are telling the missionaries that you have decided against Mormonism and getting baptized, my advice would be to keep it simple -- "I've studied it thoroughly, and it's not for me. Thank you for your time, but I will not be getting baptized." Don't give them any concrete reasons because there is no good reason as far as they are concerned. You will just spend a lot more of your valuable time discussing and arguing. They will call in all sorts of reinforcements who will also discuss and argue with you. And to what purpose? You already know what you want to do.

It would be a very poor idea to go through with the baptism just to please everyone concerned. Then you will officially be on the rolls of the church, and the harassment will really start in earnest: visits, phone calls, meetings, interviews, and callings (church-assigned jobs.) Plus you will need to formally resign in writing. It's best not to go there!

Stand up for yourself. Say "no." Practice saying it to yourself in the mirror if you need to. Say it to the missionaries either over the phone or on your front porch. Do *not* invite them in again.

The chance of your retaining any of these people as your friends is a very small one. They are recruiting you, plain and simple. They will vanish when you state that you are no longer interested. I'm sorry, but the "friendship" that they have offered you is only a conditional one. It is not the sort of friendships that you are used to having.

Let us know how things go for you.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/21/2013 05:39AM by summer.

I really feel for you, because I've been through a similar situation:

http://exmormon.org/phorum/read.php?2,814807,814852#msg-814852

http://exmormon.org/phorum/read.php?2,814939,816035#msg-816035

The best thing to do is to be assertive, and just to say you've decided that it's not for you. I know it's hard, but you know yourself that it's not the right thing for you to do so you'd only be letting yourself down if you went through with it. After you've told them, don't open yourself up to explaining why. I received a few texts off the missionaries asking why I didn't want to investigate any more and stupidly replied, and this just lead to them trying to win me around. In the end I just said that if everything was true, they wouldn't have to force their religion upon people which shut them up for a while. After that I just ignored every text.

As for remaining friends, you will find that a lot of missionaries/members will drop you like a hot potato. Honestly though, if they're willing to do that then they probably aren't worth being friends with. Once I'd stopped investigating it was as if I was blacklisted and all of the people that were texting and inviting me over for dinner disappeared and deleted me from facebook. Saying that though, there have been 3 missionaries that have stayed in touch and who completely avoid discussion of the church. In fact one came over from Utah to the UK where I live and we met up, she's actually a really great girl. I'd say that would probably not happen all the time though. I still get voicemail messages from missionaries wanting to introduce themselves but I just ignore them, and I'd invite you to do the same.

I hope it goes well and if you need support the people here are great. I don't post on here that much but I like to sit in the background and take things in. I've learnt so much here and I'm 100% sure that saying no to the missionaries was the right thing to do :) I wish you luck in whatever decision you make.

You are in charge of you, they aren't.

Just tell them "I've changed my mind, and I don't want to join your church." That's it.

These people are salespeople, and their only salary is baptisms. They will be woefully disappointed in losing a "paycheck," and they will be relentless in trying to change your mind. They will want to know what is keeping you from being baptized, and the only reason they will want to know is so they can minimize your concerns. They will want to say things like "Everyone has doubts, so don't worry about those things."

These people may be nice, but they do not see you as a friend. They have been telling you how smart you are, how clever you are, and how special you are just so you will "cash in" for them. As soon as you decline baptism they will drop you like a hot potato.

Just tell them you are no longer interested and to leave you alone.

You owe them no explanation at all.

They are just salesmen - you can tell them Foxtrot Oscar.

This frustrates me to no end. I've watched so many people come in here and they're afraid to tell the missionaries that they don't want to be baptized.

They can't make you do anything that you don't want to do. Only you can do that to yourself.

Just tell them that you've now had a year to study the church and see if it's for you, and that you've come to the conclusion that it is not.

They will tell you that it's normal to be nervous. They will tell you that it's Satan who is trying to discourage you from doing the right thing.

At that point, you can simply tell them that this is your decision and say that you expect it to be respected. Unfortunately, sometimes they will push a person to the point where they almost need to be rude.

You will at least need to be firm. Put on your best business-like voice and firmly tell them that this is your decision. You expect it to be respected and that's that. Think of them as salesman, because that's really what they are. If you don't want to buy something, you tell a pushy salesman firmly, "No."

You will probably be visited a lot over the next several months, so you might as well practice being firm now. Those people are relentless, which is scary in itself. You can get to the point where you're feeling like you're stalked.

So this is your first test in standing up for yourself. Just say, "No," and no means no.

If you are unable to tell them no prior to a baptism interview, they will ask if you believe JS was a prophet, will you live the law of chastity, will you pay a full tithing, live word of wisdom. Answering no to any of these should have them regroup on you and reschedule baptism. Then you could be extremely honest about what historical things bother you. That's just if you are unable to tell them before it gets to the interview.

You will have to tell them no at some point. Otherwise, they will keep on asking for more, and if you can't bring yourself to the first "no," you're going to be immersed in it.

Would you serve on our activities committee?
Would you accept a calling?
Would you commit to attending the temple?
Would you get married in the temple?

Hard as it may seem, the first "no" is the easiest.

"I like you, I feel like you are friends, but, no, I am not interested in joining your church."

Once a person has been baptized they are official members of a mormon church ward. There's a record of them in Salt Lake City. The Mormons feel more emboldened than ever to make demands for tithing and church attendance. Any time you miss a meeting you might receive visits and phone calls to ask why and to remind you to come next time. If you move, the Mormons will follow you and tell the next ward to fellowship you and be sure you don't go inactive.

So as difficult as it is to say no after a year of mishie lessons, it's much more difficult after you are officially one of them. They can say you've committed and made promises and that they expect you to keep those promises, pay your tithing, attend those meetings, and follow the mormon plan.

Just say no now and mean it. It's easier that way.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/21/2013 11:14AM by Cheryl.

Closebutnotconverted: I don't want to be baptized
Missionaries: But why?
Closebutnotconverted: (slight pause) I don't want to be baptized
Missionaries: Can you tell us your concerns?
Closebutnotconverted: (5 second pause) I don't want to be baptized

Like this, "after studying your religion, I have come to the firm conclusion that it is a bunch of superstitious nonsense. I do not wish to be baptized into your faith. Have a nice day."

Once you get baptized, they will track you forever. There are people here on the board who have been out for 20 years, moved several times without leaving an addresss, and then suddenly someone from church will show up at their door and try to reactivate them. And that's AFTER they've told the church to leave them alone for years.

Joining the church is like signing up on a "do not ever leave me alone" list.

And as far as remaining friends with the missionaries . . . that's about as likely as remaining friends with someone after a breakup. It CAN be done, but when they wanted more, it's highly unlikely.

Like this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZJI9eqOs1Nw



=]

To thine own self be true. Tell the Missionaries Thanks but no thanks. You have prayed and and feel inspired not to.

In my opinion, if you believe in Christianity at all, then publicly committing to a religious belief, and making a commitment to a church you don't believe in is a bigger sin than just honestly and clearly saying no. See, that requires you to lie to yourself. There's an interview before the baptism where you basically have to agree to being a mormon. When you already know that your intent would be to just get baptized and never return, that seems really deceptive and skeevy to me. I did that -- sort of, I got baptized without actually believing -- and I always felt a little dirty about that.

Better to realize that "no" is a complete sentence. Don't try to let 'em down easy, don't avoid or hide, don't try to make up excuses that seem plausible. Just be honest, clear and direct: "After all this study and prayer, I have decided this isn't the church for me and I will not be getting baptized. Thanks for all your time."

They may persist because they've invested a year in you. Don't sweat it. Stand your ground, be firm and clear with your boundaries and eventually, they will get tired of it and move on to some other victim.

OK... here is what you do.

Drink a Beer, Drink a cup of coffee, have sex, wack off and tell them you do not plan on stopping any of it.

Blam... You can not get baptized

There you go

My experience as a missionary was probably 1/2 of those who had set a baptism date backed out. Most often those who backed out just disappeared and stopped returning out calls and answering the door.

They will be disappointed but they will get over it and move on.

Remember at the very core of your relationship with them is they are salespeople and you are a prospect to buy their project. They have been friendly and probably are truly your friends but that is all based on them selling you a product. Its really no different than telling a car salesman that you don't want to buy a care.

An email or phone call that you have changed your mind and are no longer interested will suffice. They have been trained to "resolve your concerns" and believe that they can address anything. However you are under no obligation to meet with them again and people who said "I'm not interested" or "I'm no longer interested" was always sufficient to get us to go away - not point in getting into why.

The missionaries are full-time sales agents whose product is a fraudulent church/cult. Most people that they contact immediately say they are not interested, and that is the last time they speak to those missionaries.

You became "friends" because you initially showed an interest in their product. They thought they would be able to complete the sale so they continued to be friendly and spend time with you.

You never had a true friendship in the normal meaning of the word. Your value to them was their perception that they could be successful in their sales effort. The fact that you posted here shows you are a kind, considerate, sincere person and you don't want to disappoint your missionary "friends." The only way to not disappoint them is get baptized. But since you don't believe in their church and don't want to join their church, then baptism would be a major mistake.

So keeping in mind that it not possible to avoid disappointing the missionaries, you need to accept that simple fact and not be concerned about it. Cancelling the baptism should be short and to the point.

There is no reason to get into a lengthy discussion or give them the opportunity to try to change your mind. I suggest that you have one last brief face to face meeting with the missionaries. Have the meeting in a public place, or out in front of your house. DO NOT invite them into your house, as it will be awkward and difficult to get rid of them. Or better still, simply phone them.

Tell them this: After considerable thought I have decided that I don't believe in your church. I don't believe that Joseph Smith was a prophet, rather he was a scammer and a con-man. So my answer to you is "NO", I don't choose to be baptized. I never will want to be baptized, and any further contact with you would be a big waste of time for both of us.

If they say, OK, thank you, and then they leave, then you have canceled the baptism. But it is likely they will want to argue with you and continue the discussion. Your response should be to ask them a question: "What part of NO don't you understand?" Repeat that a few times, as necessary. Then say "I have other things I need to do, so good-bye."