The church isn't true, as evidenced by DNA, history, archaeology, etc.

The so-called church steals money and jobs from people, and TBM culture helps TBMs collude in taking things that don't belong to them.

Somebody on here has a brilliant plan to 'infect' the mothership of the Morg with a virus at the seminary and institute level.

TSCC is in damage control mode in a lot of countries outside the US.

There is an "October Surprise" waiting in the wings.

TSCC hid from a whole generation that Joe Smith was a polygamist, and not just some nice old guy like probably most of our great great grandparents who had a couple of otherwise normal rural farm families, but a really bad guy who broke up marriages, slept with other men's wives, and preyed on young teenagers.

Recovering from Mormonism used to be my goal, but how about bringing down this house of cards entirely? Am I deluded, or is the end or the Morg as we know it in sight?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/01/2014 03:30PM by nationalnewscampaign.

The "October Surprise" is non-existent. That's what I KNOW.

And by what means do you KNOW that?

Like you know the church is true, right?

Like I said before, it's not October yet.

You are often the first to reply on any thread that mentions the "October Surprise." If you thought it was nothing, you wouldn't waste your time. That you have an alert set for that phrase betrays your fear. You are very, very invested and afraid. Let me guess--your livelihood depends on TSCC keeping the money rolling in.

Come on now -- this October surprise is just a sham. There is nothing coming. First it was October, then January. I've decided to stop getting strung along by some embellishment or lie in something that isn't coming or is real. :(

On what facts do you base this statement "some embellishment or lie in something that isn't coming or is real"?

Anointed One - Anything happening that you can tell us? Inquiring minds would like to know!

I have no evidence. I just said that in hoping of drumming up a discussion on this board about it and hopefully learning more about it's progress. I'm a little devil, I guess :)

Yeah, I think people who believe that we can "end" the Mormon church are a bit deluded. Do you think there will ever be some fact that will come out which all the Mormons will see and be like, "Oh, yeah! The anti-Mormons are right!" Rock-solid evidence of Mormonism's lies already exists! You can put it right under their noses, and they refuse to see it. There are Mormons who can listen to everything I have to say about the Book of Abraham, proving beyond a shadow of a doubt that Joseph Smith's translation is incorrect, who then answer that they don't care, they just "know" its true. How do you plan on reasoning with people like that?

No one big announcement will bring the church down, there is far too many in leadership roles to take over the reins should a problem arise. Hell, most members would consider the second coming on its way should the entire first presidency have to go to prison for a crime. They are closer to the FLDS than they admit. Everything is just persecution and a test for them to endure to the end.

I agree with the premise that the OP put forth...infect the youth with the truth virus.

The main source of fresh victims, er, tithe payers is generational, the spawn of the duped, as it were...

Cut that source, things will dry up quickly. The corporation depends heavily on a steady income stream from the tithe payers because they spend money like drunken sailors and the kitty needs filling on a regular basis.

As a church, Mormonism doesn't amount to very much to begin with.

As a business, well, you can't get rid of a $40 billion empire without government involvement, and that's not going to happen anytime soon.

rt Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> As a church, Mormonism doesn't amount to very much
> to begin with.
>
> As a business, well, you can't get rid of a $40
> billion empire without government involvement, and
> that's not going to happen anytime soon.


I was so hoping someone would use the word "unsinkable"

Would you settle for "Too big to fail"?

I've been leaving MormonThink cards lying around all types of places now for about two years.

Lately it has occurred to me that I need to focus on places where the High school kids hang out.

That would be McDonalds, Burger King, a terryaki shop, Taco bell and a couple of pizza places.

These aren't places I usually go. If I do, I go through the drive through. I've stopped doing that. I go in to Mcdonalds, order a salad, use the restroom and leave MormonThink cards in several different spots.

I may not have any effect on Mormon kids, but I sure can educate their friends! No more drive throughs for me. Another thing I noticed....everyone that goes to these places has to cross a main road that has cross walk lights. There's a little space behind the crosswalk button that holds a card nicely. I've put several of them there. Someone is picking them up. I assume it's the High school kids.

Only 25 years ago, most people scoffed at the notion that gay marriage and weed would become legal. The world is changing rapidly. These kids with their fancy interweb skills are quite savvy. The Church may not disappear completely, but its spiral toward irrelevancy will continue to accelerate.

People also thought the USSR, Enron, and Lehman Brothers would never go down.

As far as the kids, it is not at the burger joint or the mall to talk to them, it's the interwebz.

madalice, Where do you get those MormonThink cards?

What if every person who was a bishop or even a higher calling who resigned told their story about it not being true?

I think a lot of us exMos, me included, try to respect Mormons by not talking to them about things they aren't "supposed to talk about." Or at least I USED to try to "be respectful" of TBMs around me.

That's one way the cult has survived so long, by telling everybody not to talk to anybody about the issues. "Don't even talk to your spouse about these sacred things or about your doubts."

I think by being silent, (okay, not that people posting here are silent, but a lot of exMos are silent) it helps the cult perpetuate.

just wondering, What if a GA came out and said, "yeah, it's all a sham and a scam" do you think they would scramble for the exits? scramble for their camping gear or their skis and go out and make up for lost time?

I believe she's talking about these mormonthink pass-along cards: http://mormonthink.com/glossary/mormonthink-pass-it-on-cards.htm

nationalnewscampaign - I am so with you on this. I want it to go away completely - not just fall like a house of cards, but like a 9.7 earthquake. Gone in a serious way and FOREVER.
But you question was will TSCC stop existing the way we know it? I would say YES to that. The way we knew it might be a better way of saying it since the doctrine changes nearly daily now. This back-peddling that is taking place is going full speed ahead. If there are any thinking TBMs left on earth, they must be a confused. I mean one day believe this, the next day believe that........forget whatever you believed last month, very Orwellian with TSCC as Big Brother! Just put your previous thoughts/beliefs down the memory hole and "PRESTO MANIFESTO" they never existed.
Things have been changing (DOCTRINES) off and on since TSCC began. But the internet has totally caused it to accelerated just to maintain any membership at all. I think that one of the first huge changes that certainly made members question TSCC was the whole polygamy deal....which of course the polygamy essay now doesn't really address. Some members were so freaked out about that, that they left and started new TSCCs, RLDS and FLDS to name two. That is a big deal based on changes in doctrine.
Polygamy was THE PRINCIPLE, it was eternal, infallible, written on gold plates, straight from God and yet when Utah wants statehood, it gets thrown under the bus. Bill Mahler has a portion of a stand-up on this; go to 23:45 on this site - six videos will come up, click on the top left one which shows a few audience people. It is the one that is over 54 minutes in total length.
http://search.yahoo.com/search;_ylt=A0LEVy.0cu1S4z8ABx5XNyoA;_ylc=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-?gprid=.YIaF1NKRvmzBXX1gIo3xA&pvid=nEtWDjk4LjGqHT5zUo6Abg_JOTguMlLtcrT_5oF4&p=bill+mahler+you+tube+religions+stand+up&fr2=sb-top&fr=moz35


He talks about some other TBM stuff like Kolob, Mittens etc., but also about the 180 degree change from polygamy.
It is very funny.
But it also shows how TSCC is in the survival business - survival of itself that is.
I hope TSCC goes away completely, but I know that it is going to change so much that it is no longer recognizable from the TSCC that JS started. This is necessary because as one of the profits said (I think it was a profit, maybe some other big wig), the entire church rests on whether or not you believe JS was a profit. Since everything about him is a disaster as it comes out, I can't see how it can survive even close to what it is now (today) or tomorrow, (when it will be different again.)
I BELIEVE that there is an October surprise. Tom Phillips has too much integrity to pull a JS con job on us. If you don't think so, listen to the podcast of the interview, 4 hours in length. His integrity practically drips from your computer or whatever device you are listening to it on. Just wait and see. Tom, please keep on with your project. Legal crap takes a long time.
Posters, BE PATIENT! One of the posters said "One big announcement won't bring TSCC down," but do take a look at what the one big announcement "No more polygamy" did to TSCC. Big impact. With the internet and global communication, ONE BIG STATEMENT could rock it to the foundations if not actually taking it out.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/01/2014 06:28PM by verilyverily.

madalice - putting these cards around is such fun. I am in a region with not too many TBMs, THANK Moron-I. Deciding where to put the MormonThink cards was easy for me. There is one ward here in town and I put the cards on the windshields of the cars during the 3 hours of snoring that they call church services! One person looked out the window but didn't come out, probably thought I was putting cards about some service like dry cleaning or something. I was putting cards about a service far more important than dry cleaning. People do put things on windshields often.

[That's one way the cult has survived so long, by telling everybody not to talk to anybody about the issues. "Don't even talk to your spouse about these sacred things or about your doubts."] - this shows that TSCC is afraid and running scared. Talking about your religion including the parts you doubt should never be taboo. What hypocrites! They tell everyone to HASTEN the WORK and EVERY MEMBER A MISSIONARY on one hand and on the other it is "DON'T TALK ABOUT ANYTHING IN TSCC THAT YOU DOUBT." For some TBMs with doubts, they may not leave much that they can talk about.

nationalnewscampaign - Are you pretty savvy with these kinds of things? If so, please do a throw-a-way email. If you prefer I do it, let me know. I do want to talk to you.

I don't think the "end" of the church will happen in our lifetimes. Maybe in 50 years it'll shrink to less than a million members or something like that. But it will never disappear completely. There's loads of crazy religions out there which still have thousands of members.

verily, I think this is the way for us to get in touch with each other: one or both of us needs to go to the trouble to make a throw-away email account. then we post the address on a thread, exchange our real email addresses, and don't have to use the throw away email account....unless there are lots of people who want to get in touch and it's useful, of course!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/01/2014 06:31PM by nationalnewscampaign.

I think it will implode. There are members rebelling. Women were shown on national TV trying to attend a priesthood meeting and being turned away. They pushed for women doing the opening prayer at general conference. There are people who are staying and injecting the idea that you should think for yourself. They are blogging contrary ideas also.
I have a feeling there are few places for these kind of members to turn, and I am of the idea that many of them are right here among us seeking understanding and answers.