Posted by:
Elder Berry
(
)
Date: February 25, 2014 04:16PM
Erick Wrote:
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> My point is that if we accepted the "official"
> narrative about the Urim and Thummim, except that
> sometimes Joseph Smith placed the divine and
> sacred instrument into a hat...would that somehow
> make the religious narrative less plausible?
I believe it is less plausible if you actually find out what people at the time said about it. If your point is the medium isn't the message I get that. Smith could have "sometimes" gone skinny dipping in a pound close to where he had hidden The Golden Plates and by "seering" into the water with his ass high in the air "see" the words he needed to tell Oliver/Emma/Martin when he came up for air. As long as there was a plausible nice neat and clean explanation alongside the bizarre one, no need to destroy the message because of the medium right?
http://user.xmission.com/~research/early/court1830.htm"Cross questions-says, he has not known the prisoner to look in the glass within the space of two years last past.
Josiah Stowel, being by me sworn, saith, he has been acquainted with Smith, the prisoner, for quite a number of years; that he did pretend to tell, by looking in a stone, or glass, where money and goods and mines were in a manner peculiar to himself; the prisoner had followed digging for money; pretended to find mines, hid treasures, and lost goods, and frequently others would be digging with him; says that about three years since, prisoner was put under arrest by an officer at Bainbridge in Chenango county, for breaking the peace, and that he escaped from the officer and went to Palmyra; and that about two years since, witness was at Palmyra, and saw prisoner; that prisoner told witness, that the Lord had told prisoner that a golden Bible was in a certain hill; that Smith, the prisoner, went in the night, and brought the Bible, (as Smith said;) witness saw a corner of it; it resembled a stone of a greenish caste; should judge it to have been about one foot square and six inches thick; he would not let it be seen by any one; the Lord had commanded him not; it was unknown to Smith, that witness saw a corner of the Bible, so called by Smith; told the witness the leaves were of gold; there were written characters on the leaves; prisoner was commanded to translate the same by the Lord; and from the Bible got from the hill, as aforesaid, the prisoner said he translated the book of Mormon; prisoner put a certain stone into his hat, put his face into the crown, then drew the brim of the hat around his head to prevent light-he could then see, as prisoner said, and translate the same, the Bible, got from the hill in Palmyra, at the same time under a lock and in a chest; and the prisoner, when looking for money, salt springs, hid treasures, &c., looked in the same manner; did not know that prisoner could find money lost, &c.; and that prisoner told witness after he was arrested in Bainbridge, he would not look for money, &c. any more; told witness he could see into the earth forty or fifty feet," "