I am sorely disappointed that with about 1/3 of my FB friends being LDS, I got no responses to posting the NY Times article about Smith's polygamy. How many here posted it on FB, and what kind of responses did you get? Or was it the silent treatment like I got?

None of my mormon friends said anything either, and I have about 100 of them. I guess most just don't care.

Or maybe they say nothing because they know that there is nothing to say. They have been defending and worshipping a degenerate so what response is there?

Mixed. Some say that they can't handle it and don't want to look further (head meet sand). Others try to use a scholarly approach to explain it away. And some silence. I doubt that those who are really affected will vocalize their concerns ... At least on FB. We can only know the effects over the coming weeks/months/years.

Up until about a year ago, I was so paranoid that my disaffection was being watched by higher powers that I used to delete my cache every hour and if i dared speak to anyone, I would beg them to 'destroy the evidence'.

Silence is very telling.

Nothing from any of the TBM's on my friends list, but in general when reading the various posts about the polygamy essay, TBM's really believe the myth that teenage marriages were common in the 19th century.

Ask them for sources to back up their claim.

One nevermo living in SLC shared Pat Bagley's cartoon. That's it for me. But then, I only have around 25 "friends", only two of which are TBMs.

I had one FB friend who complained about how TBM's are shocked and didn't know. She maintains that she always knew, therefore, everyone else should have known too. Some of her other FB friends also piled on and basically blamed everyone for not knowing.

Ah, but just what was it they "always knew"? Foster daughters? 14 year olds? Currently married to living men? Hmmm? And you revere this scumbag as god's chosen to restore what?

She's big into Face Book and still a TBM from what I can tell. I asked what kinds of things she has seen relating to it. She said there wasn't much traffic on it and what she did see was "I already knew that" and "It doesn't change my testimony" kind of stuff.

I think this whole thing is causing some issues for TBMs but most of them simply will not admit to doubts.

She obviously hasn't even read the essay, so how would she know what's in it? I'll bet there are bits she did *not* "already know". But if she can't even be bothered to read the church's own drivel, there's no point to a discussion on it.

I only had a couple of people respond. They both defended Joseph saying that he didn't want to do it, but was commanded to do so and blah blah blah.

I didn't have many friends post about it, but the ones that did were mostly grateful that it was acknowledged. Don't think it's gonna change any of their minds though.

I have most of the TBMs in my life on a special blocked newsfeed. I see what they post only when I want to. I checked it out (maybe 35-40 of them) and crickets. But far fewer "faith promotional" posts as well.

One TBM friend who is the son of a GA was the only one brave enough to post church related material. It was something to the affect "I'm a Child of God... Click like if you are too!" He has several hundred TBM friends and two "liked" it

The silence is very telling. In this game of narcissm and sociapathy orchestrated by the church, there are only "win", "lose", and "draw" choices. For TBMs when it comes to the church, there is only a choice of "win" or "draw". Under their paradigm, there is no "lose" option when it comes to the church. So they default to the "draw" selection when it comes to what the church has said. That's what the silence is about. Notice how there is no "win" option made available by the church's anonymous authors. The TBMs know they cannot refute what their church leaders have told them in these Essays and that these things that the church is admitting to are not acceptible. That's got to be a hard pill for the TBMs to swallow. But it's the only one they've got. LDS Inc doesn't give up anything for free. Something's up! God lacks the need or the ability to repent. So why should the leaders who represent him ever repent of the mistakes they've made in his name? This stalemate can't go on forever.

What would you do if you were a crew member of a ship that had been taken over by pirates. 1) run the ship aground, 2.) light the thing on fire, 3.) bail out.



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 11/13/2014 12:06AM by azsteve.

Here's something from a TBM on a Facebook post



What really bothers me about this is that it took public exposure via Internet to bring this to light. This is typical behavior for large bureaucracies, which only change under outside pressure... But then why is the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints acting like a typical bureaucracy? I expect the one true Church of God to be better than the organizations of the world. To see the Church acting just like a normal large business is saddening

I put Strawman's list on my FB page today.....
This is it
STRAWMAN COMETH
As the new essay unintentionally hits the fan, Mormons are reeling and responding with their classic denials, claim of victim-hood and their typical repertoire of logical fallacies.

Soon, their favorite defender, the straw man argument will be in full regalia, culminating in a passive aggressive indirect platitude statement (such as doubt your doubts, you have to go around the BOM, etc.) in the next general conference to which members will cling to for life.

Already I have been contacted by members with their straw man babies. So I have compiled a list of the quorum of the 15 straw men:

1) It’s not that some girls were married “back then” at age 14. It’s that she (Kimball) was not married to Joseph, since he was married to another person who was not aware of the situation. 14 years old were by no means older back then.He had sex with his foster daughter, period. He has sex with men who he sent away on missions and made the wives lie about their liaisons, full stop.

2) Joseph was forced to practice it by an angry angel. Joseph must have been one hell of seer to know to start practicing it before the revelation AND the angry angel came. It’s that none of the 40 women, suspiciously, including Emma, ever saw the angry angel. It's that he didn't have 40 wives, he had one, and 39 KNOWN affairs that he spend most of his time and efforts trying to conceal.

3) It’s not that the church is being "honest". It’s that there is a term for when before you are being honest, for 180+ years.

4) It’s not that some marriages MAY not have had sex, it’s that some did. It’s that some were married to other men and some were children. It’s that the ones that turned him down were destroyed and shunned. It’s that all were coerced or forced to practice it. It's that the church has, for the past 180 years, trying to collect, destroy or file away any reference to these relationships being physical.

5) It’s not that it's OK because Emma accepted it, it’s that Joseph got her best friend pregnant and did not tell Emma, and she in turn threw her pregnant friend down the stairs and she miscarried, maybe the peace came after that or after she threw Fanny Algers on the street. Maybe the peace came after she left the church.

6) It’s not that people are demanding that Joseph smith be perfect, it’s that maybe a convicted con man, polygamist, bank defrauder, fugitive, liar, pedophile, wife-thief, serial adulterer, plagiarist and murdered might not be the best person to trust with a story about an invisible gold book.

7) It’s not that it was about raising children, or marrying a virgin, or being approved by the first wife or that it was OK after 1834…because none of those applied to Joseph.

8) It’s not that it is OK because “it was a long time ago”. It’s that it happened. It’s that those girls were children. It’s that it was a revelation and then he denied it in May 1844 (he had 30+ wives by then) and offered to prove his accuser to be perjurers and to provide (falsified) affidavits.

9) It’s not OK because you have a testimony. It’s that your testimony is based on a fictitious character carefully created by the church media department. If you have a testimony, you don’t know the real Joseph.

10) It’s not about the church discontinuing the practice by the commandment of God. It was that they were forced to by the US government and therefore it shows that the church will change its history, doctrine, practices, and policies to make sure that the corporation survives.

11) It’s not that it is not practiced now. It’s that Gordon Hinckley lied on national TV a few years ago and said it was only practiced after they came out west and it was not doctrinal. It’s that an angel is pretty doctrinal and that thousands of now ex-Mormons were excommunicated, attacked, called names and shunned for even suggesting what these essays contain.

12) It’s not that it’s a fleck of history. It’s that thousands of children suffer in sexual relationships with adults in cults TODAY because of the practices and doctrines you cowardly failed to address, up until now, and which your founders taught as a requirement to enter heaven.

13) It’s not about polygamy; it’s about your church pretending that they are the defender of monogamous marriage between one man and one woman as stating that this has always been so. It’s that you are stepping on the civil rights of others, just like you did those women, in the name of religion.

14) Is not that the church has abandoned it, it’s that the concept of men forcing women and children into their bed using revelation is "a thing" in your doctrine. It’s about Warren Jeffs being JUST like Joseph Smith. He did not die an innocent lamb at the hands of evil men, he died because he slept with children and other men's wives, he died because he violated masonic oaths, he died because when his adultery was exposed by his former close associate, whose wife he tried to shag, he destroyed the printing press.

15) It is not that the media and world does not understand Mormonism; it’s that you don’t understand Mormonism.


My sister is not speaking to me at all now. My polygamist cousin I'm sure is ready to kill me, I put it on her message board and she lives in Colorado City.
I think Strawman states these thoughts very well and I want people to know how I feel. I am way beyond worrying about hurting their feelings. They need to know the truth for their own sake. They have spent years telling me how awful I am what a horrible sinner etc. I got kicked out of the CULT because of the rock in the hat. They owe me an apology for that now that they admit it. Well the shoe is on their foot now and I am ready. Stand with me posters and let's get the entire CULT to collapse like a house of cards. OK?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/13/2014 02:03AM by verilyverily.

Great post!