I have someone asking where the confirmation is that GA's receive very HEALTHY compensation, in addition to RE holdings, etc. The one link I had about it is no longer working. Can anyone point me to the best place to find it -- with at least some documentation for the info there?

The one big compensation that's been cited since it emerged is Grant Palmer's recounting of meeting with an MP and, I believe a 1st quorum 70. Mr. Palmer reported that he was told that when a GA is called, he is given a large sum of money that is to be used to set his financial affairs in order, in other words, the GA pays off all his indebtedness. But there is no 'hard' data supporting this.

But even with no debts, and no income, you've still got expenses, like food, clothing, personal items and property taxes.

If the MPs can get open ended credit or debit cards, why wouldn't the GAs get a couple each, to use for food and clothing? Even the most devoted patron of the "unpaid clergy" theme would allow for a stipend, to pay off property taxes...

Plus many, if not all, serve on corporation boards, and there's a payment for that 'service.' And some of them write books.

All their travel is paid for, the probably have gas cards and maybe drive church leased vehicles. Tommy tools around in a $900,000 armored Audi...

Most people who reach the age at which these guys are now called are expecting to live 'retirement life', meaning they had an idea about the level of comfort at which they'd be living. The GA clowns live a much more, in their minds, exalted life. They may not be snorting lines of coke of the naked breasts of $1,000/night hookers, but they get their rocks off in other ways.

I sincerely believe that becoming a GA would adversely affect my golf game, so if nominated, I would not run, if elected, I would not serve.

As for rock solid, irrefutable documentation, only the church accounting department has that data. All we have are rumors and inferences.

Up for more discussion

Part of it is on the FAIR site, they admit there at least $175,000 for some GAs.

They try to bluff around the rest, and don't mention that this is more than twice the US household income, and that it is all tax free, given gross.

No mention of the fact that people think GA is a religious calling and contradicts the BOM support themselves edict.

No mention of the free first class flights anywhere they need to go and how much they cost, or any other expenses they wish to submit.

What isn't discussed is that the Q15 get - which is rumoured to be much more.

Bottom line, $175,000 a year tax free for giving a few talks on a sunday and going around missions when all the real work is done by volunteers is a bit rich.

Most members will be shocked to hear this, as i was always taught these guys were independently wealthy and self funded like missionaries.

FWIW I used to review the rax returns of some GAs therefore I have first hand knowledge of the amounts they are paid. However, I did not keep any copies of those tax returns. As a trusted TBM why would I?

Actual documentary evidence would, therefore, be hard to come across. I therefore recommend the following accessible documents for an indication of the MINIMUM level of compensation.

1. The Mission Presidents Handbook. This varies according to the family and other circumstances of the MP, whether children are at college, receiving private education at an international school etc. However, I calculate a low average 'gross# salary of $175k per MP. Remember, some will be less and some more.

2. Financial statements filed with the UK, Canadian and Australian government agencies indicate payment of salaries of $150k or more for the church's senior employees. Temple Presidents and Temple Recorders are also in this bracket. These documents are on public record and accessible. Church HQ directors will be paid substantially more as they oversee these 'local' employees.

The above documents indicate levels of gross compensation. The GA 'living allowance' and perks are paid tax free and are higher than employee compensation. If grossed up to assume a salary before tax and ss deductions, their minimum pay will be upwards of 300k p.a. There are different levels for 70, Apostles and FP.

Bottom line - no definitive documentation is available until someone leaks actual documents, although that will not tell the whole story due to the way church accounting disguises and hides such matters. However, filed documents mentioned above and the MP Handbook indicate a minimum 'gross' salary of $300k for GAs. Therefore the suggested range of $300k to $800k is entirely credible.

Tom... What about the BOOK DEALS? I have to imagine that EVERY one of the top 15 that want to write a book receives a ghost writer AND a GUARANTEED PAYDAY not matter how many copies have sold.

For example, Holland wants to write ANOTHER book. So he picks a topic and puts some notes together. His secretary works with a ghost writer from the church. Books goes to Deseret Book and he gets a check for $500,000. Book retails for $19.95 and sells 30,000 copies–who know and who cares.

Possbile Tom?

Yes, but it would be royalties they receive, percentage of book price, not the total retail value.

Certainly there are many add ons to their 'modest' pay of $300k - $800k

The LD$ Inc book publishing deals are a multi million dollar proposition for MORmON ASSpostHOLES..... just as they are for LD$ Inc.

Paul Dunn was very popular at one time. Paul was only a 70 GA , not a top tier quorum of the 12 (or 15 or 16) ASSpostHOLE GA, even though Paul could spin BS yarns much more akin to Joe Smith's ability than most who were senior in MORmON leadership rank to Paul, even though Paul was much more popular than the seedy way past their prime top tier LD$ Inc leaders.

When MORmON style rock n roll star Paul, who hit the MORmON style concert speaking tour for all that it was worth, he had book sales that dramatically out performed his senior leaders. THAT became an embarrassment to the more senior LD$ Inc leaders. It was like a spot light pointing out how old, out of touch,
(STALE) and enfeebled that Senior LD$ Inc leaders really were.
When it was revealed that many of Paul Dunn's highly entertaining stories were fabrications (LIES)(not to be confused with the Joe SMith fabrications (LIES) that MORmONISM was founded on) it became a HUGE embarrassment for LD$ Inc.
It took a few months (years), but Paul Dunn's book sales finally dropped below the sales levels of the MORmON ASSpostHOLES.

It was almost like proof that MORmONS have a huge appetite for BS and a preference for LIES over truth.

The Top GA's do not always fly first class...they fly chartered private jets. They do not pay for the suits they wear...those come from ZCMI before every conference. They do not pay for the houses/condos they live in. They do not pay for their security team. They do not pay for their servants (..errr...I mean staff), or for their flower arrangements. They do not pay for the art on their walls, or their other travel expenses. They do not pay for their catering for private functions or for the vacation homes they go to on church-owned property. They do not pay for their own funerals.

ALL of those costs come from the adoring members of the church. So...why do they need a modest yearly stipend (of at least six figures)? What do they need to purchase that is not already covered?

They will say that this money does not come from tithing...it comes from the other corporations that the church owns (Beneficial life, Murdock travel, Bonneville Communications, etc) So why does a church need to own corporations exactly?

There is a whole web of financial dealings and hidden money that the members do not know about. I know that some people would say that the church does give to helping the poor. The church gave $40M/year for the poor. The church also spent way more than that in flowers/parties/clothes each year for the top leaders.

The argument that such monies come from businesses and holdings, and not from tithing is tenuous, at best.

Let's say that a Mr. William Tithing (a not-so-subtle representation of our tithing) gave 10% of his income to a broker, and that broker invested it in...I dunno, land in Florida, and that land increased in value, the land an the increase still belong to Mr. Tithing.

The monies raised to pay them might be from the profits of an investment made from another investment made from another ad infinium, but it was first tithing money, wasn't it? Maybe not mine, but someone's.

And now it's a salary.

praydude Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The Top GA's do not always fly first class...they
> fly chartered private jets. They do not pay for
> the suits they wear...those come from ZCMI before
> every conference. They do not pay for the
> houses/condos they live in. They do not pay for
> their security team. They do not pay for their
> servants (..errr...I mean staff), or for their
> flower arrangements. They do not pay for the art
> on their walls, or their other travel expenses.
> They do not pay for their catering for private
> functions or for the vacation homes they go to on
> church-owned property. They do not pay for their
> own funerals.
>
> ALL of those costs come from the adoring members
> of the church. So...why do they need a modest
> yearly stipend (of at least six figures)? What do
> they need to purchase that is not already covered?

They need to dole out wads of cash to their MORmON elite children that I have to compete against in the job market, who probably attended BYU for free as a MORmON elite leadership perk, while I had to pay my way to the fullest extent.
That way the offspring of the MORmON elite can have better grades and a head start in the job market while I was slaving away and academically faltering while trying to support myself and go to school, because I had paid their way first.
If I sound bitter, it is only because I am! LD$ Inc leaders belong in Prison. They pull a Bernie Madoff level rip off scam every year, AND they get away with it by invoking the name of (the MORmON version of) Jesus.

The GA's don't even pay tithing - at least they didn't in 1844:

In August 1844 the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles issued an epistle which required all Mormons to immediately pay 'a tenth of all their property and money . . . and then let them continue to pay in a tenth of their income from that time forth.' There was no exemption for Mormons who had already paid one-tenth of their property upon conversion. In January 1845 a Quorum of Twelve's epistle reemphasized 'the duty of all saints to tithe themselves one-tenth of all they possess when they enter into the new and everlasting covenant: and then one-tenth of their interest, or income, yearly afterwards.' However, two weeks later the Twelve voted to exempt themselves, the two general bishops Newel K. Whitney and George Miller, and the Nauvoo Temple Committee from any obligation to pay tithing. This was due to their services to the church.

Apostle John E. Page's enforcement of the full-tithing requirement for the rank-and-file led to his disaffection from his own quorum. Exempted from tithing himself, Page felt guilty about collecting tithing from others such as one Mormon who gave $4 which was 'the tenth of all' the man and his impoverished family possessed. Upon abandoning the Quorum of the Twelve in 1846, Page complained that he 'believes that many paid tithing & in consequence of [this, were in] want of money enough to procure misc. necessaries of life.'

Reference: D. Michael Quinn, "The Mormon Hierarchy: Extensions of Power," chapter 6
http://mormonthink.com/tithing.htm#definition

Thanks to everyone who sent info. Much appreciated. I have another question about "perks", but will start another thread for that.

Please note that the big bucks and perks do not hit until in the Q12 or FP. 1stQ70s are paid a decent wage, but per one 1stQ70 I know quite well, his tithing was more than his church wage. Lower ranks are paid even less, and based on need, thought there are some perks. AA70s only have expenses paid.

But damn! Make the bigs and the money just rolls.

Do you really think that the 1stQ70 member you know told you the whole truth about his salary? Does this member of the 70 have a CRUT account and not paying taxes?

I'm sure that, when questioned, the GA's will make up some comment about not getting anything other than a modest stipend. To say anything else would erode the member's faith in the church and hurt all of the GA's at the top. It would be in the is GA's self-interest to claim that they don't really get any serious money.

It's not like they ever lie or anything.

I have not seen his tax return or a paycheck, but he is totally honest, including discussion of 2nd anointing, the inside scoop on politics, his interactions with other GAs (who is nice, who is arrogant, who is a back stabber). So yes, I would say he tells the truth. On the other hand, prior to becoming a GA, he was a successful business man, to his GA salary would still be livable.

Any business knows that the best way to keep their top executives in line is to provide sufficient perks that it would be almost impossible for them to leave.

Why should Joseph Inc. be any different?

Exactly. In Joseph Smith's day they one perk the higher ups got were extra wives and lots of sex. Now it's is everything else as well.

MP's kids get free college? Anywhere, not just BYU? Grandkids? At what level do they qualify for education perks?

Hinkley ADMITS the GA's are paid. He says,

"...the living allowances given the General Authorities, which are very modest in comparison with executive compensation in industry and the professions..."

https://www.lds.org/general-conference/1985/10/questions-and-answers?lang=eng

Its interesting that he says they are modest compared to EXECUTIVE COMPENSATION. In other words, the top dogs in the LDS church are paid a s**t ton more than the average member.

Ex-CultMember Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hinkley ADMITS the GA's are paid. He says,
>
> "...the living allowances given the General
> Authorities, which are very modest in comparison
> with executive compensation in industry and the
> professions..."
>
> https://www.lds.org/general-conference/1985/10/que
> stions-and-answers?lang=eng


Lets run that Gordon BS Hinckley statement through the Urine and Thumb-in MORmON meaning truth interpreter:
"which are very modest (according to BS artist Hinckley) in comparison with (OUTRAGEOUSLY OBSCENE) executive compensation in industry and the professions...."

Reformed MORmON Translation: LD$ Inc executive leaders are entitled to excessive amounts of funds to live on while rank and file MORmON members are obligated to provide the funds that go to executive LD$ Inc leaders, even at the common member's own extreme deprivation, no matter how difficult that things are for common members. That is what MORmON members agreed to in the temple ceremony !!! However, top LD$ Inc leaders are not required to be forthcoming and transparent about this situation, no matter how much LD$ Inc claims to endorse being honest and forthright. Further more, screw you petty rank and file members for even asking about this. You will be required to pay extra money to LDS Inc. for making this inquiry of your exalted supreme LD$ Inc leader.

Even though that statement is nearly parenthetical (damn near non-existent), I decided to print that off as a PDF because it exists on lds.org and who knows if it will survive unchanged/undeleted.

MORmONISM and the Hinckleys have nothing to hide! just ask them !!!!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MUcyR7Qv_1o

The leaders of the church could practically prove the church true if they were to release records of all financial dealings over the years and it were clear that the leadership hadn't been riding high on the hog.

I'm not sure that even if they did release their financial statements if the members could make heads or tails of it. The mormon finances are such a web with all of the different offices and subsidiaries it would take legal experts a while to figure out what was really going on.

Still, having the information available would make it easier to see what kind of money the church was spending on itself vs supporting charitable causes.