Over the years I have notice this, and come up with a theory.
TBM's desperately desire their church to be seen, on a national scale, as mainstream, normal, and relevant. This desire is, in part, to legitimize their faith-ego; to transport their church weirdness into acceptability.

For example, BYU football fans greatly, fervently long for a winning team....and make it to the national rankings. They know that would help bring positive image and exposure to TSCC. They desire this so badly!

Also, the former presidential candidacy of "Mittens" had Morg folks salivating that perhaps the "Church" could be headed toward acceptance and mainstream.

But it's not working. Most people outside of Utah don't care about the tiny dot on the landscape that is Mormonism. It remains irrelevant to the masses....

I do believe you are right.

The Mormons though are their own worst enemy--continually more so --and thus getting further from that magical goal of acceptance and esteem all the time.

They should have left well enough alone. For so long the rest of the country gave them little thought and those that knew of them considered them one of those harmless,odd, "boutique" religions. That could have worked well. Less is more.

But somehow they managed to segue into Westboro territory. Good luck getting rid of that reputation.

BYU having a winning season really could be their last hope.

I've often thought that non-Mormon's outside of the MO-Corridor must think of the Mormon Church in much the same way I think about the Jehovah Witnesses. They have a bunch of very weird ideas and knock on people's doors wanting to get them to join. Other than that, I know almost nothing else about them and DO NOT CARE TO LEARN! I'm always polite and calmly tell them that I'm not interested when they come knocking.

Posters on Daily Kos, the largest liberal political blog, clearly did not share the Mormon adoration for Mittens. Judging by most of the postings, I am of the opinion that Romney did far more bad than good for the Mormon Church. I have been on Daily Kos for many years and religion is almost never discussed unless in a negative way such as fundamental Christianity's opposition to abortion.

Some of the bloggers were surprised and sometimes shocked to learn about the weird beliefs of Mormonism. Many had no idea a twenty-first century religion still had such antiquated beliefs. These things would likely have never been known by them had Romney not been a nominee for president.

Templar Wrote:
-------------------------------------------
> Some of the bloggers were surprised and sometimes
> shocked to learn about the weird beliefs of
> Mormonism. Many had no idea a twenty-first century
> religion still had such antiquated beliefs.

It's reading things like this - then thinking about how my entire family 100% believes - that really puts things in perspective for me.

It's moments like this where the phrase "I was raised in a cult" never seems more real.

I've been out for two full years now and that fact still shocks me to think about. I, yes >I<, was raised in a cult. All while I was witnessing the FLDS and Scientology shit on the news thinking how crazy it would be to be a member of those groups! HA!

The church leaders have long appeared to be struggling with staying on a narrow line between mainstream and peculiar. They have a big base of really conservative tithe payers to appease, but they want to appear more midstream.

The whole corelation movement seemed to be designed to stomp out the really oddball old doctrines that popped up on their own in wardhouses.

Even with Prop 8, they were with the majority of Americans at the time. Mostly since then they have just kept their heads down.

Then came last week. They fell off their tightrope and landed squarely and voluntarily on the peculiar side.

So THAT'S the true "Straight and Narrow!"

I dont understand why they even want to appear mainstream. After all, didn't God and Jesus tell Joseph Smith that all the other religions are wrong?

""Mittens" had Morg folks salivating that perhaps the "Church" could be headed toward acceptance and mainstream." - EXCEPT he refused to do what members are supposed to do and that is when people ask about the CULT, members are supposed to use that as an chance to be a mishie and make an effort to convert people to the CULT or at least tot each them about the CULT. Mittens was so ashamed of the CULT, he would not talk about it at all. I imagine the CULT top 15 hate Mittens.

My tbm mother in law loves to claim that people who are non Mormon are drawn to her and her Mormon lifestyle. Somehow they can just "feel" inside their heart that she is special and glows with (according to her) the light of Christ. They always are inquiring what she has that they are missing. Gag. Mormons are better than everyone and deep inside non Mormons know it. That is why we must share the 'gospel'....although then who will they be better than next??

your MIL is totally clueless lol. I see that type thing everyday, the Mormons I know are like, "everyone is so impressed with my life, my values, blah blah blah, they just talked with me" and then the Mormon goes away and the other person is like, "OMG those people are nucking futs! Did you see her, she had this wierd glazed over eyes and turns out, she's only 43 but she has 8 kids and looks like she's late 60s!!"

Exactly green Angel!! You have no idea how badly I want to tell her that.

Mormon's are greedy. They want to be able to discriminate all they want to be a "peculiar people," but be just like everyone else when it comes to American culture.

Who will Mormons deride? Worldly musicians. Who will they embrace? THE KILLERS.

Who will Mormons deride? Hollywood. R rated movies. Who do they fawn over? ANY Hollywood or television actor who is Mormon. (They even fawn over actors who USED to be Mormon.)

Mormon's want to be liked and they want to fit in... All while excluding others for being different.

What mainstreaming?? Everything they've done and the recent gay policy announcement just set them back several decades!

This is the leadership. Just like racial injustice, the leadership was driving the members to discriminate. MANY TBM's in the 1960's and 1070's had come to the point where they didn't like church policies against blacks and were calling for change.

Give the current church policy on LGBT issues a few years and it will be a millstone around the neck of members and the organization. Then, and only then, will the leaders change the policy.

amen to the setting back, here in Texas they were associated with polygamy and now they're associated with polygamy and hating gay people.

it's hilarious and sad.

What a huge Ouch for them! Talk about a double whammy!

"polygamy and now they're associated with polygamy and hating gay people."
Gee! Imagine how they'd feel about polygamous gay/lesbian people!
You want to talk about HATE?

The mormon temple ceremonies and "worthiness" interviews will never make them mainstream. Mormons just don't realize how creepy they are. Secret handshakes and magic underwear. Mainstream? Really? I think not.

The Proclamation on the Family was a direct attempt to ingratiate themselves with American Protestants. I grew up in Southern Baptist land, and they did not view Mormons are Christians. Fellowship of Christian Athletes (FCA) was big in my HS, and Mormons were not allowed in.

GBH thought that fighting against gay marriage would make Mormons lots of friends. He underestimated the strength of the gay rights movement, and the impact of gay Mormons on TBM families. While they did gain some respect from right-wing Christians, they did enormous damage to their "family" image with Prop 8 and the most recent cock up.

Mormons desperately want to be loved while at the same time being proud of being different. They think everyone praises them for not drinking alcohol or coffee, but most people don't give a damn whether they do or not.

Their antigay gambit has put them in the same position as their racism did 40 years ago. They gained little ground with Protestants and Catholics but lost a lot of ground with their own more liberal members, especially those with gay kids.

axeldc Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> GBH thought that fighting against gay marriage
> would make Mormons lots of friends. He
> underestimated the strength of the gay rights
> movement, and the impact of gay Mormons on TBM
> families. While they did gain some respect from
> right-wing Christians, they did enormous damage to
> their "family" image with Prop 8 and the most
> recent cock up.

Kinda makes one wonder what happened to Joseph's god who spoke to and through him often. Apparently, most Mormons haven't a clue that the claim "the prophet will never lead the church astray" is clearly bogus.

The Mormon Church can never become mainstream as long at it holds on to the "man becoming god" bit. Even though Gordo lied to Larry King about it, it is still the underlying purpose of temple ordinances - especially the SA. If TSCC were to do away with this fundamental doctrine they have nothing left. What would little MoBots progress to become - a ministering angel without plural wives and a non-usable penis? Who would want to be a Mormon then?

Lack of details about day-to-day life in the 'afterlife' isn't helping them, that's for sure.

During the Olympics in Utah 2002 the church had a lot of lds volunteers and missionaries to help out. I do not know however if that had let to many baptisms.

Curious, do Mormons to be seen as more mainstream or do Mormons want the mainstream to be more Mormon like?

Hi Terry,

I think the former. They want the Church to be viewed as more mainstream, to gain acceptance & justify themselves both personally and as an institution. As individuals, I don't think Mormons care all that much if the rest of the world becomes more like them.

but mainstreaming without revelation can only go so far and will eventually fail...especially in the Information Age.

The mormon church doesn't only want to be seen as mainstream. They want to be in control of as many peoole and their money as they can. Being seen as mainstream is the holy grail to making that happen for them. They will never really be mainstream though. Too many people know too much about them. It's like amway. How many people want to attend an amway meeting? Everybody knows about them. Other than a handfull of people who grew up with it and don't know better, no one's interested. The novelty wore off somewhere between 1960 and 1980. Google will tell you more about the mormon church than the missionaries will including secrets that the church doesn't want anyone to know about them. Their potential is limited.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/21/2015 08:13AM by azsteve.

Offering nineteenth century solutions to twenty-first century problems doesn't do a lot of good. Many times I've thought about the fact that the religion which fulfilled a definite need for my pioneer ancestors is not at all relevant to me.

In the final analysis, the debate over whether Mormonism is true or not (it isn't) in many ways isn't the prime consideration. The major question is does it fulfill critical needs HERE AND NOW? For more and more individuals, the answer is increasingly no.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/21/2015 08:57AM by Templar.

I think many of them, especially those sequestered in Utah think they are. Whatever. Just keep them in their sheep pen of Utah and humor them so the rest of us don't have to deal with them.

So I guess they haven't noticed that the "mainstream" religions are declining in membership even faster than they are (in most cases), huh?

Silly mormons. Always behind the social times, and not paying attention.

Their upcoming Christmas campaign is such that one won't be able to separate them from other Christian denominations. Remember how the commericals of the past would talk about the BoM and it being "other testimony" ?

Well from what I can tell, nada about the BoM this year. Nada JSmith. Zero. Zilch.

Smith and his book have left the building. Or at least the campaign, and we all know those two things make Mormonism distinctively different.

I remember very well when MORmONS did NOT care at all IF the traditional Christian sects / other religions considered MORmONISM to be valid Christianity or not. My MORmON Grandparents did not care at all if they were considered to be Christian or not by any of the non members that lived around them, anymore than they cared what the chickens, cows, horses and pigs thought about the matter. After all, why should they/ MORmONS care? "NON members" were basically subhuman, they were animals that managed to look and act a lot like humans but they really were not human because they were not intelligent enough to be considered human by accepting and embracing "THE" (MORmON) gospel, because anybody with a truly functional human brain would be compelled to become a member of THE (MORmON) church. SO, "Non members" were subhuman, and that at best, IF they were not really outright evil, you know -like the foul spawn of Cain and designate agents of evil, Satan's representatives on earth in mortal flesh, the dreaded people cursed with dark skin. The opinions of such substandard members of society hardly matter to God's chosen people - "THE" illustrious members of "THE" (MORmON) church. The non members should just be grateful for those very rare occasions when my MORmON grandparents did see fit to give them polite cursory social acknowledgement by saying hello or waving or speaking to them at all. MORmON god knows that it was far more acknowledgement and recognition than they are really entitled to. When members of other churches finally properly care enough about religion, truth, God, and decency to not be so pitifully substandard, then they can join THE true church -MORmONISM. Until then they can literally just go to Hell. And that is exactly how my MORmON grandparents acted. I have to somewhat correct myself though, because MORmONS did care about being considered non Christian by other churches, because they actually ENJOYED it. They enjoyed it as it maintained the ongoing contention between MORmONISM and Traditional Christianity, the contention that MORmONISM was founded on, The contention that drives the pathological MORmON persecution complex and allows MORmONS to feed their sick twisted egos.

It is comical to listen to the current MORmON quest for MORmONISM to be considered a valid form of Christianity by Traditional Christianity, BECAUSE IT WAS MORmONISM THAT STARTED THIS "YOU ARE NOT REALLY CHRISTIAN" DEBATE AND CONTEST AND CONFLICT IN THE FIRST PLACE. Since it is no longer working quite so well for MORmONISM, as in since it has blown up in their MORmON faces, MORmONISM now wants to call off the fight that they wanted to start, did start, and are now losing. AS IF they deserve some sort of consolation for losing the fight that they started, MORmONS feel that they are entitled to be considered part of the Christian community. The Christian community is supposed to be oblivious to the reality that MORmONISM really wants this ideological proximity to Christianity for the sake of easier back stabbing of the Christian community and for more ready gleaning of converts from Christianity to MORmONISM by MORmONISM. When the Christian community does not want to accept this new (predatory) arrangement as dictated by the MORmONS, then MORmONS complain that the Christian community is unfair and a big bully. To cap things off, in true ULTRA PHONY PRETENTIOUS MORmON form, MORmONS still want to play the victim in this situation.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QknCsJQBcco

don't you feel sorry for the POOR POOR MORmONS !!!!

Hardcore Mormons desperately seek validation, while desperately clinging to their "uniqueness". They're pushed to be exceptional (or at least pretend), but still beg for acceptance within mainstream popular culture.

Exactly, which is why if you call them on their weirdness, they get upset. It's letting the world know what a bunch of "wackos" Mormons are (so they are not well accepted with their non-Mormon peers) that will slowly lead to many of them waking up and the eventual downfall of the church.