I was reading in another exmormon forum, a thread in which returned missionaries reported on how many of their former companions have left the Mormon Church or become less active or inactive. One interesting thing some of them said was that the "wildest" missionaries sometimes turn into uber TBMs after they are home, while very devout missionaries sometimes in time turn apostate.

About a year ago, I asked a Mormon missionary about statistics I've heard about Returned Missionaries leaving the Church or becoming inactive. He said that APs, Zone Leaders, and those who go home early are much more likely to leave the Church or become inactive than are regular proselyting missionaries or even District Leaders.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/02/2016 03:13PM by commongentile.

On my way to the airport to go home from my mission I got into a conversation with the AP taking me to the airport. This was in 2001 shortly after 9/11. When we finally arrived at the airport and were saying goodbyes, he said the next time we see each other he will be inactive. This guy was a mega rule follower and I thought he was crazy. He told me statistically, because he is AP, he should be. I found him online in 2005 from a blog he created and sure enough he was no longer a member.

Hmmm, my mileage does vary. Most people I know are still in both raging, devout TBMs and those who would sneak a puff of weed at a church party. One lackluster member from my YM's who played in a band [gasp!] "prays" for his family on FB. Cringeworthy but that's the level he's on.

Facebook suggested friending a former companion that lives about 100 miles away from me. I have not heard from him for years. His Facebook page looked very TBM, with very TBM wife and kids. I was not sure I wanted to contact him, but he replied he only attends to keep peace in the house and avoid divorce and he had heard from the grapevine I as out. We're going to try and get together sans TBM wife this fall.

I was a strong TBM and a very dedicated missionary and look where I am now? :)
Passionate people tend to be more real and no-nonsense than others. But this could be just my opinion.
I hope you and your former companion have a great time :)

foolmoon wrote: "Passionate people tend to be more real and no-nonsense than others."

An astute observation. I can see how those who take questions of faith seriously rather than simply going through the motions may be more prone to make it through to the other side, or at least have a head start.

getbusylivin Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> foolmoon wrote: "Passionate people tend to be more
> real and no-nonsense than others."
>
> An astute observation. I can see how those who
> take questions of faith seriously rather than
> simply going through the motions may be more prone
> to make it through to the other side, or at least
> have a head start.


This has been my observation too. The most devout seem to be more likely to leave and become vocal about the church. One of the most stalwart has now become the god of his own board patterned after the board where he used to post.

Yes the ones who are more devout and truly believing are the ones who are hurt the most when they find out the truth.

ALL the LGBTQ returned missionaries I've known have left.

Every one.

I get taking some time to adjust, but if you've been out for a few years and still cling to Mormonism, you have serious mental health issues. It's like a dog loving the man who kicks him daily.

Smart types

When I served as a missionary, I honestly believed in Mormonism and often bore my testimony saying I knew the church was true. I served in leadership for most of my mission.

After returning home and enrolling at BYU in 1962, I learned about the Tanners and got on their mailing list. I bought and read several of Jerald's books and was really shocked to learn the Mormon version of its history wasn't true. In 1968, the translation of the BoA papyri was published and shortly thereafter I left Mormonism for good.

A testimony based on faith as mine was is worthless - especially when it is so easy to show that the truth claims of TSCC are clearly false.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 07/05/2016 12:08PM by Templar.

France is notorious for turning missionaries into exmos, but most of the "pagans" I know left the church. I was pretty disenchanted with the mission about halfway through, but I stayed in the church another 5 years before I left.

I can see APs leaving because they see the sausage being made. They live with the MP, and realize that not only is he not sacred, but he's also very flawed and probably a jerk. They see missionaries having problems and being punished for them. They see decisions made like everyone else making them, and pretending it's "inspiration". They see, as I learned, that the church cares for numbers, not people. They see the church is a respecter of persons, and that some animals are more equal than others.

I understand avoiding former comps. Being gay, the judgment I get isn't worth it. I will accept friend requests, but I stopped seeking them out long ago.

axeldc Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> France is notorious for turning missionaries into
> exmos...

Add another one to the tally here :)

I was "devout" and obedient as a missionary, but never made it past DL. Probably because once I hit that level, I figured out the fraud, and mainly just went through the motions for the remainder of my mission.

I did, however, leave (and not just slink quietly away, I left by making a statement to the bishop) within 3 months of getting home.

(a reference to the Euro soccer championship currently in progress - and a proud tribute to my exmormonizing adopted homeland)

And axeldc and IfIcouldhietoKolob, if you ever come back for a visit - I want to meet you! :-)

Tom in Paris
(soon to become French because of Brexit)

Tom,
Wife and I are planning a visit to London and Paris next summer. I'd love to meet up as well. I'll be in touch!

I hung out with two ex companions tonight. One was very iffy on his mission. He went because he thought it was the right thing to do but had a very shaky testimony. The other was pretty strong in the church but had made a few mistakes on the way. I was pretty gung-ho about being a missionary when I went and had a very strong testimony.

The shaky one never trained or was in leadership but he is active, married in the temple, and has two children. The second one was a DL and trainer at one point, met his wife on his mission, converted her, and went inactive over a few more years and now is completely out. I was DL, never trained, but baptized much more than most other missionaries. I went to BYU, got married in the temple, was a temple worker, and got divorced after two years. (ex left the church and we both realized the church pushed us into it). I've now completely left the church.

We're all still close friends but we all find it ironic that the shaky one hasn't wavered while we have. We all had a good laugh about it.

I can't think of any assistants who have left in my mission. I know a ZL and DL or two who have, but I can say that I do know a lot of missionaries who weren't in leadership at all and are super active.

What I have found from my own mission and the RMs I've talked to is...

1) Upon return, many of the ZLs, DLs, uber missionaries immediately temple marry (BYU mostly). Since they're priesthood holders and active, they tend to get assigned Gospel Doctrine classes or Elder/HP quorum leaders, etc... It is then because of their diligence in studying or researching topics...they find REAL doctrine and history. They then find out how much they were lied to.

2) The less valiant or lazy missionaries, tended to be those who are out on missions just to please their parents and/or to marry their H.S. sweet hearts. They don't care or concern themselves with real studies or testimonies. It seems they are the real programmed TBMs. They seem empty and shallow but they fulfill the role they were assigned and convince themselves they're happy.

The members of my family who remain active are the ones who never really took the church seriously in the first place. They were the ones who go to the cabin on the weekends or get away during the conference times.

Or they could always get substitutes so they could go to another family member's baby blessing.

The meeting would have collapsed if we'd done such a thing (at least that's the way we looked at it at the time). We were in a small branch for a while.

We lived in a place where birthday parties on Sundays were a thing. And, of course, community soccer and baseball was always on Sunday. That stifled our participation.

We were the no shopping on Sundays family--the 100%-ers. You can't miss a meeting. Even if you have a fever. Yes, I was one of those. It's pathetic and embarrassing to think about.

But, yes, we are the ones who feel the most betrayed.

When I my mission ended the MP gave me a "stay strong in the gospel" pep talk and he mentioned that most APs leave the church or become inactive. I was shocked. It was the opposite of what I expected and actually, at the time, I couldn't imagine anyone going inactive.

I do see a general trend. The more sincere you start out, the more contrast there will be between the ideal you see in the Mormon church and the obvious reality of what that church really is once you are in the trenches.

It isn't that the we couldn't live up to the church--as Mormons like to say about us. It's that the church couldn't live up to us.

I have been debating whether to chime in here or not. I am not meaning to high-jack this thread. My intent is to share how I, as the first assistant to my mission president, became an ex-Mormon. Perhaps this would be best posted under it's own thread but it does apply to the OP.

To begin, my companion from the mission field connected with me after 20 years of silence. We had been great friends in the mission field. After I came home, he was called to be an assistant to the mission pres. Obviously he was still very stuck in the church and was encouraging me to reflect on my time in the mission field and especially the close connection I had with the MP. This is the letter I sent to him as he had and called and written and was trying to reconvert me.

(I will change the names in my account to protect the identities of those involved.)

" Dear "Friend", I so appreciate hearing from you on the phone. Hearing your voice does stir some very fond memories. President XXX was a wonderful, caring man. I was also his first assistant and so I got to see a side to him that I think many may have missed.

He gave me what I felt was profound counsel in our final interview which served me well and I knew was a bottom line truth for me.

I do not know how aware he was of my pre-mission life. From the counsel he gave me, I would assume he had done some checking because I doubt I would have spoken about it to most people on my mission.

My bishop during my teenage years was a really hard liner and I followed his direction with dedication. (He, at the time of end of mission, was on the Stake High Council and continued to ultra religious and rigorous in his adherence to gospel principles. We had more like a 'father/son" relationship.

I also had a 'best' friend in High School who adhered very closely to the Bishops directives as well. As President XXX and I visited in our last interview President XXX suggested I not continue in my friendship with those I had associated with before coming on my mission.

I found myself in complete agreement with his counsel and appreciated feeling and knowing that he was on my side. In truth, I wish we could have discussed this in more depth but I was still much too wet behind the ears to hear more or be able to compute the seriousness with which President XXX was coming from.

I got home and my two old friends greeted me with fervor and dedication. My High School buddy, (I will call him "Togo" as that is what he liked to be called), claimed to have been 'born again' on his mission to Cumorah (New York State) and my now ex-bishop, (Gordo) had been getting directives on building a city of refuge for the saints in the latter days. (When evil would have become even more rampant and the returning of the Savior was eminent and upon us.)

Both were eager to enlist me in the cause. Partly because of what President XXX had told me I resisted their efforts and used humor to respond to their never ending and prodding. They considered me to be way too light hearted and light minded and doubled down on their efforts to recruit me.

After about six months, Togo finally cornered me and asked me if I would answer one question in seriousness. I was quiet tired of the game and, after thinking about it, I decided there was not a question he could ask that I couldn't recover from or dance around so I told him I would answer his question... What was it? He simply asked me, "What is your relationship to Christ?" That was the beginning of the unraveling for me and they soon had me marching in the ranks of ultra conservatism and religiosity.

Fast forward four years. I was now married and had my first daughter. I was still well entrenched in the dogma and edicts of the the super religious. The remodeling of the St. George temple had just been completed and it was time for it's re-dedicating. Togo was the Stake mission president and Gordo was still in the Stake High Council. Because of their positions they were invited to the re-dedication ceremony.

They went.

I don't know what all the ceremony was about but when they returned they came to see me. While in the Holy of Holy's in the temple they had both received a revelation. Our Stake presidency was going to be changed and Gordo was going to called as the new Stake President, I was to be called as his first counselor and Togo was to be called as the second counselor.

I was at a new level of being shocked. Pretty heady stuff but yet I some how knew this wasn't quite right. I remember thinking to myself, "Finally, something concrete to base the future on. If this really happens, I will accept that it is from the Lord and that I need to double down and do as the Lord requests/requires. If however, this doesn't happen, it is my ticket to escape this over the top, zealous behavior and belief."

I had been ultra committed to living the gospel ever since my mission and doubly so since my renewed and active involvement with Gordo and Togo (who our mission Pres. XXX had cautioned me to not continue my friendship with).

So the three would go to the temple two or three times a week and during that time we selected the men who would be called as Stake High Councilmen. The present Stake President was being released and his potential replacements were being interviewed. Gordon was one of them. The selection was made and Gordon was not the man. In fact, the person called was Gordon's Stake High Counsel Partner. Scott and Gordon were flummoxed and they came and told me the news.

A flood I relief swept over me as we stood there together. I looked at both of them and said, "At this point, I do not know what is right or wrong all I know is that I am through with talking religion with either of you. Do not approach me further on anything".

I took a job in Salt Lake City as a security guard on temple square and I began a quest to figure all of this out. Heber C Kimball had been one of my favorites and I found and reviewed his writings and the writings of his son David. I became very uncomfortable at what I was finding. Then I read about Parley P Pratt and found another part of his story that no one had ever mentioned before to me.

My exit journey would continue for another 20 years. I didn't have the Internet to go to, just the documents, the Journal of Discourse and the Journals of various men and women who had been Mormons. Polygamy became a rather large red flag for me as did the Mountain Meadows Massacre, the Book of Abraham, The Kinderhook Plates, The Book of Mormon and --- the list simply kept expanding and my devastation became such that no longer could I keep adding things to my shelf.

I am not wanting to disrupt your beliefs or get you to follow my path or agree with me. I simply tell you a small portion of my journey because in reality, it began with our Mission President, XXX. I wish I could review my journey with him now. I wonder what he knew and was aware of way back when, that we didn't speak about. He seemed to be a very smart man and extremely intuitive and a GOOD man.

Had I followed the Mission President 's counsel, I know my life's journey would have been considerably different. Not that I am complaining now. I've learned so much and it's all good and life is good and I love more completely and more passionately than I ever thought possible. All is well.

Amazing story, I think I read it before, perhaps it's posted in the bio.. I wonder what became of Gordo and Togo?

I continue to be amazed at those of you who have kept in contact with former comps, remember many of your non-comps, remember APs, etc.

I didn't even remember 3 of my comps until I recently had occasion to look up who they all were in my diary. I did not meet any of my former comps even once. I only knew one AP, and that's cuz he waz my LTM comp. I couldn't ever imagine him leaving. Ever. But who knows.

Interesting thread.

I was a fairly diligent missionary that tried, but never really had his heart in it. I went to the Czech Republic and virtually nobody (and I truly mean nobody) was interested in talking at all. It turned into an excercise of me counting down the days until I could go home. I just could never genuinely believe all of it. I always felt the weight of guilt for me to do this and that. I stayed active for quite a while after my mission, about 10 years. It was more of a social function for me, and not a religious experience.

It's one of those things that is so hard to get rid of. The church just sucks you dry and then tries to make you feel guilty when you resist. I've now been inactive for several years and it is finally starting to just slip away from me. I feel robbed in a sense that this damn cult took so much of my life from me and left me with nothing. FUCK!

"The church just sucks you dry and then tries to make you feel guilty when you resist"

^^^this^^^

I wonder if that's a part of it. The über' give and give and give, until there's just nothing left.