One year ago to this date a 29 year old man came into the life of my 21 year old beautiful daughter. It has been the most sickening year of my life......

She was doing her college internship, for first grade teaching, graduating early, living with her older sister and her fiancé. She is a gentle soul, always giving and loving,a Christian who attended church, the middle of three sisters whom I have taken the loving time to raise and make sure they were always bonded together.
She was the shy one.. but had gained confidence in college, could easily tell a guy to beat it if he wasn't treating her right.
She and her sisters, and I were inseparable until this beast broke us apart with his lies, and crazy ideas that he has fed to her.

At the beginning.... he would keep her on the phone every night until she finally fell asleep, then would call again at 5:30am to be the first voice in her ear..
Every weekend she would make the 3 hour drive to see him... she stayed at his place (which I later learned was not allowed by Mormons) and would drive back home only to have to work with little kids all week, just to do it all again..

He's charming, charismatic, married twice before, with a 7 year old daughter and 2 previous domestic abuse arrests all of which he claims happened when he left the church when he was younger and going through a rough time. He is a personal trainer, boasts constantly about himself.

Fast forward.... The following things happened all while we were planning her older sister's wedding that just wrapped up Sept 29th...with no knowledge by her family until it was done..

She was baptized in January, engaged in June, married in July and I just made her tell me at her sisters wedding last weekend what i knew in my heart.... she's pregnant. I can barely write the words.

I have to get her away from him before this baby is born or I feel her loving family will lose her forever...

Please, any advice... assistance on where to go or what to do I would be extremely grateful.

She's an adult. She gets to make these decisions. Your best path forward is to keep the channels of communication open. Leave mormonism alone until she brings it up with you.

Let her know she's welcome in your home any time

I hate to say it but she's already broken the ties that bind with her loving family to marry this man she believes however wrongly, is the one for her.

Only time may mend the rift. The secrecy I don't know what to tell you.

The cult does drive wedges between families. I know because I've been on the receiving end, like you are right now.

Keep praying for her. Have faith and hope, and lots of patience that she'll come to her senses if not now, then in time. Be there for her when she needs you. What more can you do than to offer her your love and support now more than ever?

I'm not sure what to tell you to do other than BE THERE FOR HER as this doesn't have a happy ending. Try to keep lines of communication open in some fashion so she knows she has someone to turn to.

You've just described my worst nightmare. I'm sorry this happened. You have my commiseration. I have no idea how I would handle this with my kids.

This train has left the station and will eventually derail. Sadly, some people have to learn life's lessons the hard way.

He sounds like he might be a controlling prick and may try to isolate your daughter. If you come across as working to break them up, you may make things worse.

Keep the lines open, maybe have a weekly Skype session if you can. Don't openly judge or talk badly about the situation. Eventually, she'll see his true character. When she needs you, give her a way out, and a soft landing place, and don't say "I told you so."

(((((((OP))))))))
There
are not even enough hugs for this. My heart so does go out to you. As others have said, the best thing you can do now is to keep communication going with your daughter. Please make it abundantly clear that she and your grandchild will always be welcome to stay with you. She will eventually find out who and what he is. I was in a terrible, abusive marriage to a sociopath. The only reason I stayed in as long as I did is because I had nowhere to go, as my parents were the opposite of supportive and I was not welcome to stay with them. Your child has a great safety net! What a sweet parent you are!

Your story sounds exactly what my sister did. She met him on lds singles dot com and all heak broke loose and that man destroyed my family.
It's been many years and soooo much damage but some things have gotten better.
My best advice is educate yourself about sociopaths and narcissists.
Start with the book "The Sociopath Next Door". Then go on to "Rethinking Narcissism"

The hardest thing you will face if you are brave enough to really truly understand what's going on here is the impairment, deficit, weakness, or disorder your daughter has that has made her "choose" him. We can find ourselves taken unawares, but there is something she's doing, something she's ignoring or being dishonest about. She might have a subconscious hunger for the thrill, the drama. It's something individual to her. It's going to take time and lot of struggle to understand

Whatever you do, don't fall into the trap, the urge to label him a "monster." he is only human too and you should be wise and realize he has his problems and weaknesses.

Sometimes the best thing to do is cut off all contact. Don't assume your daughter will protect you from what he might want to do to you. Sometimes YOU are the target

A lot of condolences and some good advice, above, in unfortunately small amounts. As a few have stated, you're capacity to influence is greatly diminished.

If possible, help encourage and guide her to get her career back on track. LDS norms for women are (exaggeration) "barefoot, pregnant, and in the kitchen" --and highly dependent upon the males in her life, especially financially. If she has a career, 1) she may find a sense of purpose and fulfillment outside the LDS marriage & church bubble, and 2) It gives her the option for independence should/when she have to go her own way.

Quietly research laws in her state on domestic abuse, separation, divorce, and child custody issues. If they're in Utah, and you're not, he will have very powerful legal, cultural, religious, and relationship ("priesthood") advantages. Should her marriage go bad in crisis mode, you'll have more to offer her than mere sympathy and general relationship advice. Consider finding non-LDS lawyers and social workers where she lives, also, "just in case." Keep a file, but also keep it very private. You have to do the preparation she can't imagine doing hersel

Set aside as much accessible cash as you can for an emergency fund.

Last thought: it may seem weird, but congratulations on your upcoming grandchild. Reach out to her, and the baby, in your capacity as grandmother, so that 1) your grandchild has a positive relations, and 2) you maintain relationship connections with your daughter. Be prepared for efforts on the husband (and his family & church) to isolate them from you and your ungodly world.

There are no immediate solutions, except prayer. You're playing a long game. Think and prepare accordingly.

Godspeed!



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/03/2018 03:24PM by caffiend.

Read Steve Hassan's website. He has excellent advise on how to help someone in a controlling relationship.

"It is important to listen to your loved one. Don’t make them feel stupid or belittle them for being in a controlling relationship. Help them be empowered to think for themselves. Act curious, but concerned, and ask thoughtful questions. Don’t threaten or use ultimatums. Build trust and rapport. You may want to think about who can participate in an ethical influence campaign to help your loved one resist undue influence. Are there any friends or family members who are also concerned?"

https://freedomofmind.com/controlling-relationships/

Hoping the best for her and for you.

What denomination is the church she attended?

Have you heard of Rick Ross?

Find his divorce proceedings to get the ex-wive's names then look them up on social media. You may learn more about him through analysis of the exes... Even just finding out who filed each time might be a good thing.

I agree with those who say to keep the lines of communication open. Try to listen to her without judgment. The one thing that I would tell her, given her husband's history of spousal abuse, is that the FIRST time he hits or slaps her, she is to exit the house and call you. Tell her that it doesn't get better and she deserves better than to be hit. Tell her that you will provide her and your grandchild with a safe harbor. I'm sorry to say this, but it's not a question of if, but when. Save up some money to come to the rescue when that happens.

Learn as much as you can about Mormonism, but don't bring it up with her. You are more than welcome to keep posting on this board. I'm sure that you will have a lot of questions, and we are here for you.

I feel like I may be a little manipulative here, BUT, you are going to have a grandchild--that should be a new door to be even more involved in your daughter's life; besides her partner, a woman normally bonds more with her own mother as she navigates the ups and downs of becoming a new mother.

IF she starts putting up barriers, you'll know that she is either being fenced in by him or her "new family" the EllDeeEss church.

Have you met the in-laws? Seems telling that you didn't mention his family. And another question--how did they meet? He lived hours away so he had to drive to see him, and you didn't say he ever came to visit her much. Sounds like he groomed her; not that tons of other non-mormon men don't do the same thing, but mormonism is ingrained with from the start, by none other than Joseph Smith, Jr....

You will not lose her forever.

This guy has been through two wives already, which means that evetntually she will wake up and smell the coffee. Or Postum.

Be very cordial to your son-in-law. Be careful what you say about him to your daughter. When the time comes that she is ready to leave him, do NOT say "I told you so."

but I think you already knew that.

Having been in your daughter's position, my guess is that she will not allow her baby to endure the things that she has to endure. That was my breaking point. Wasn't going to let my daughter grow up in a house with a monster for a father. I knew firsthand what that was like. Wasn't going to let it happen to her.

But as long as she is infatuated with him, isn't much you can do. Give her money, when you can, that he does not know about. My family did that for me. Chances are he is watching every penny she spends.

Oh, by the way my family of origin was EXTREMELY Mormon, and the man I married was EXTREMELY anti-Mormon. So you can't stereotype this. Nevertheless, my family stood by me until I saw the light.

My experience soured me on marriage forever.

But I got a beautiful daughter out of it who has a great relatjonship with my siblings (most of whom are not TBM anymore)

So tred carefully, find good things to say about your SIL (keep your friends close and you enemies closer, as the saying goes) and wait and see.

I came back to my birth family, and my experience was so traumatic I almost went back to the LDS church.

But I didn't.

Lois

I'm sorry you're going through this. I have similar issues with my sister and her fiance. There are red flags with him all over the place. And my sister sounds a lot like your daughter. I don't have any advice really, other than to say I understand the worry...

A poster above suggested that if he (the husband) strikes her (the daughter), get out of the house, and call you (the mother). I respectfully disagree.

Heartbrokenmom, try and get your daughter to understand (even agree, if possible) that if she is ever the victim of ANY kind of violence, she is to cal 911. This will generate some kind of record, and probably a police report, and possibly an arrest. She should have a cell phone that is not on his account, for a large number of reasons. His being a "personal trainer" ("Mr. Muscles?") and previous record with two wives frightens me.

I'm not going to disagree with that, Caffiend. But the daughter will also need a safe place to stay, and ongoing support.

Priority One is the daughter's (and baby's) immediate safety. It's important that a police report be created, and a paper trail started. A good-sized police department can refer a victim to appropriate resources. Family options can be a good solution

The tragic frustration is that, very commonly, female victims often defend, protect, and return to their abusers. That's why I counseled HeartbrokenMom,

Read up on domestic violence and the cycle of abuse.

I'm well aware of it, Caffiend. I have one such family among my students right now. Fortunately the mom reported the dad for assaulting her, and he was arrested (he has a prior record as well.) She is safe and her children are safe for the present time. We have taken steps at school to protect the kids. The kids are escorted everywhere by a staff member. We went on lockdown just a few days ago when the dad showed up at school. I have run through various scenarios in my head, "What do I do if..."



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/04/2018 07:00PM by summer.

There's nothing more difficult than feeling you're losing a child and not being able to do much about it. Our children are precious. Sadly, when they reach adulthood, we can't control what they do.

Stay in communication with her and be there for her if and when she needs you. I wish we could get her back to you, but that will be up to her.

Good thoughts to you. This is difficult, but you'll get through it. Take care.

A lot of good advice above. Keep in loving contact with her on a very regular basis!

I would add - pay for a complete background check on the guy: arrest records, complaints, lawsuits against him, any court records including divorce court and allegations against him such as, abuse towards ex-wives and children, custody restrictions etc. You have to know what you (and your daughter) are potentially up against.

Just have a relationship.You don't have to believe in the same things.

If he's been married twice already, it may be only a matter of time before this one blows a fuse.

Hope for the best for both of them. Give them your blessing. Then prepare for the worst, just in case she comes home with her suitcases packed and a baby in tow.

In my reply from yesterday I realized for you that their "worst case scenario" will be a blessing in disguise for you, because that is what you are hoping for, that your daughter will return.

I hope so to. Families were not meant to be torn apart by secretive, cult religions.

I suspect that the problem here is not actually the Mormon angle, although I don't think it is helping.

Fundamentally, you are describing a controlling, abusive predator. He will become violent. Pregnancy is associated with an increase risk of violence in abusive relationships, and whether your daughter realizes it or not, this is already an abusive relationship.

Being on here will allow you to learn a great deal about Mormonism. He will likely use Mormonism to increase his control over her. So, it will be particularly useful for you to know about Mormonism, particularly if your daughter is brave enough to leave him. Having someone who is supporting her resistance to going back who can counter him on Mormon BS will help combat guilt trips and other tactics that he may try.

Fundamentally this is a domestic violence situation (even if she hasn't been hit yet). You may get far more useful information from domestic abuse hotlines and organizations. They may have very specific advice for the parent of a victim trapped in an abusive relationship.

1000 thank you‘s to everyone for the advice. I already feel like I made progress last night as I did not let her/him just text me I made her have a real live phone conversation
I could tell he did not want her to speak with me since she had been crying hysterically, and trying to rush me off the phone. told me she is now suffering from panic attacks. I was patient, kind and reassuring and told her I would like to see her soon.

Also looked up his past relationship and will be doing more research on them.
Question... when will they be sealed in the temple? And when will they baby be?
Please keep the helpful tips coming. God bless you all :)

Wow... hysterical crying and panic attacks! It sounds like she already knows she's in deep trouble with this guy. Is there some way you can actually go and visit her?

Temple sealings for a new converts are typically allowed around a year after baptism, assuming both spouses are found to be "worthy" by answering a series of interview questions regarding their commitment to Mormonism and the moral behaviour and if they pay the church 10% of their income.

It is likely, given her husbands past divorces and arrest records, that the Bishop and Stake President will be extra diligent with questioning him. The sealing is not necessarily anything to worry about. You should be most concerned about her husband"s abuse history and his manipulation and isolation of her.

Another thing I strongly suggest is to call the Mormon Bishop, Relief Society President, and Stake President that serve in your daughter's Mormon congregation called a "Ward" You can find their contact information if you know your daughter's address. Aside from what you read here, most Mormon's are good people. Since this guy has a history of abuse and an arrest record, the Mormon leaders will likely be more helpful in monitoring the situation with your daughter. If all else fails, contact the local Welfare Government agency to do a welfare check.

PollyDee Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
If all else fails, contact the local Welfare Government
> agency to do a welfare check.

Get the business number of her local police department. As a retired cop, I know that vulnerable young women sometimes call a trusted relative (fathers, especially) when they have a dangerous crisis, instead of 911. So it's possible she reaches out to you, which could escalate a problem (or crime) in progress. If she's in Utah, and you're in Nebraska, you can't call her 911--it reverts to your city department. So you need the Utah phone number (available on their website).

A visit from the police sends a signal to the husband.

You tell the person who answers you are out-of-town and and have knowledge of a crime-in-progress, and want to be connected to the dispatch desk. Share what you know, especially your daughter's condition (pregnancy or presence of a baby). The rest is up to the local cops. Ask how you can obtain a copy of the police report that follows.

Returning to PollyDee's point, above:

The daughter called mom, crying and in a panic attack. An appropriate action would be to call her police department and ask for "a well-being check," which we do when people haven't been heard from, newspapers & mail haven't been collected, children haven't attended school, a person's medical situation is uncertain, etc. It would go like this:

"Hello, 'XYZ Police?' I'm calling from PDQ, Nebraska, and received a disturbing phone call from my daughter who lives in XYZ, and believe a well-being check is needed. Can you connect me with your dispatch desk?..."

HeartbrokenMom, you need two files (at least). #1 is resources in her city: her bishop and stake president, social workers, police (especially if they have a family violence specialist or unit), shelters, other churches (especially if she was brought up in a denomination), her husband's police records, local politicians, etc. Anybody and any organization that might be helpful.

#2 is YOUR paper trail. Keep a journal of phone calls, texts, pictures & images, police reports (they're public record), summaries of conversations you've had with others (bishops, police, etc.)

Knowledge is power. A controlling, possibly abusive husband wants to control his wife, your daughter, and isolate her from outside resources (family, especially, a cultic tactic) and information. Your job is to be loving and available, and very discreetly create an armory of knowledge.

Godspeed!

Oh my gosh what great advice. I’m going to print this and keep it in case I need it for a future problem. Thank you.

I have mild anxiety and occasional panic attacks. They can be scary! Mine resemble heart attack symptoms. What helps me is to do long, slow, deep breathing. I also try to distract my mind by doing mental exercises such as reciting the prime numbers, reciting the alphabet backwards, etc. You might try these suggestions with your daughter.

Unfortunately, the Mormon church, with its emphasis on perfectionism and lack of genuine forgiveness, can tend to exacerbate anxiety.

Your post is dated Oct 4th, so what you are saying is that there was contact last nite that resulted in hysterical crying? So the problems are now surfacing? You have been given a lot of good information on this thread by some very knowledgeable people. I think it’s time to put some of these suggestions into action because of the hysterical crying and your perception of attempts by them to get you off the phone.

Don’t worry about the “sealed yet?” stuff. The answer is probably not, but that’s irrelevant. It doesn’t mean anything more legally than a secular marriage does. The problems are more immediate than a temple sealing.

I don’t have any thing to add to the good advice you’ve already been given but after noticing that this post from you was reporting a very recent encounter and not merely a worry about future events, I wanted to encourage you to get involved before things escalate.

In your situation, there is nothing that you can do. You can only state to her what you are saying in here and hope that she listens. If she doesn't, it is ok. It is her choice. Just let her go and the truth will come out in time.

I respectfully disagree. Heartbrokenmom can prepare, as I stated in my long post, above. A bit more thought: she can gain an understanding of the underlying falsehoods and cultic practices in Mormonism, so that if/when her daughter leaves (marriage and/or LDS), she can understand how she was deceived.

Regarding temple sealing. A man can be sealed in the temple to numerous women. Mormon doctrine says that all of those wives will remain married to the man in heaven. If his previous marriages were temple sealed and there wasn't a temple divorce, your daughter then becomes his third heavenly wife. She may or may not be aware of that.

However, I think any future temple sealing is the least of her/your problems.

caffiend has given you some great advice.

Good luck. Check in when you have questions and let us know how things are going.

It's a nasty operation to try and get someone out of. And even if they come out they may never be the same.

I am truly sorry. I wish there were something I could do or some advice I could give.

Yup - been through that too. Some 30 years ago. Some things never change.

Ain't nothing you can do. And it sucks.... Just gotta love that family oriented church -