I want you to think about your family, friends and yourself. I’m wanting you to set aside all your hurt feelings and be honest. In this post I will share my admittedly limited perspective. I’ve came a long way with Mormons but I will try to be as unbias as possible.


The question is: are Mormons happy?


My limited perspective: I think the children are very happy. As far as the adults I’m not so sure. Something seems to change between childhood and adulthood. Mormon folk tend to be a very serious people. Now I’m not saying there is anything necessarily wrong with that. They are very successful by the worlds standards for sure. It’s just looking at my limited time spent with Mormons I can’t think of any happy ones. I know I was miserable when I was in a shitty marriage and LDS. So I don’t know if it was being LDS or the marriage. I’m grasping at straws to think of a happy adult Mormon. There was a newly called stake president that literally smiled 100% of the time. That is a hell of a skill to have for sure. He could’ve been happy. Other than that I seriously can’t think of one. I must admit I spent more time with the men than the women. Maybe relief society is a very joyful place. I know we said we were happy during f&t. They also appeared happy during the love bombing phase. I’m not saying I have anything against Mormons. I will probably post something similar to active Mormons. I guess another question is what is better happiness or being serious?

Life is filled with joy, which of course is the reason behind the oft repeated admonition:

"Endure to the end"

I endured to the end every Sunday. Then in another week I had to endure all over again.

Probably no more or less happy than any other group.

That’s a good point. Mormons are of the world whether they like it or not. But is Mormonism good for people? I think it could be, but not the way it is now. Not with its current management structure. Mysticism was the value proposition, and with mainstreaming there’s nothing special to justify the busy work.

But who am I kidding? They will never build their Zion because they can’t. They’re wandering the desert without a Moses. But that’s okay, there are plenty of other forms of mysticism to take up the loss from Mormonism.

You're right, it's difficult to gain a pure perspective, without our own personal biases. I had two HELLACIOUS marriages, with two Mormon men. One was a demented con artist, who beat me almost every day, until I crawled away forever, getting police protection, and the other cheated on me and ended up abandoning me and our children. So--I was not happy in my Mormon marriages. I was not happy on Sundays, married to a temple Mormon, married to an "inactive" Mormon, or divorced and single, with or without children. Mormonism is not designed for the happiness of women, period. I was RS President, my mother was RS President, and I've known many other RS Presidents. That's one of the most prestigious church positions for women--but it was still a thankless job, full of grunt-work and busy-work. Like cleaning the buildings, most of the women's church jobs involved cleaning, cooking and washing up afterwards, babysitting and changing diapers. I always ended up getting my hands dirty, staining my nice clothes, or getting a contagious illness, until I learned to delegate. I set a boundary at cleaning the church building--for me and my children--and told them I would pay a professional to do it, but not send my children into child labor. Constantly saying "no" got very tiresome, and I cringed every time the phone rang. I took piano lessons from age 6, and continued at the universities. I put myself through school teaching piano lessons. I loved music! But LDS, Inc. burnt me out by their constant demands for piano and organ duties, sacrament meeting performances and rehearsals, the old road shows, the Christmas parties, Christmas choirs, the Messiah, etc.

The cult took the joy out of music, and I have not touched the piano, since I resigned, and I don't miss it at all.

In observing the lives of others, I have come to the conclusion that the Mormon church does not make peoople happy; rather, it makes people unhappy. The focus is on life after DEATH. The doctrine is full of THREATS of what will happen to children who ditch out of Sunday School, or adults who don't pay their tithing, or members who are late for meetings, or talk too much in the foyer, or WHATEVER.

Like babyloncansuckit wrote, there's the dread of the next Sunday coming up, so the unhappiness bleeds into your work week and into your Saturdays, as well.

To answer what the OP asked, whether it is better happiness or being serious--you need BOTH states in your life, and all the levels in between. Being serious does not mean being unhappy. Being spiritual does not require unhappiness. When you are happy, junk like changing diapers can be a task done with joy, love, and songs for the child. Cleaning up the school kitchen with the PTA was fun and social and filled with laughter! People would bring their spouses to our fun planning meetings. I'm glad I had those normal experiences with volunteer groups of all kinds. My education and career have had very serious moments, with a lot on the line, but it was always stimulating and rewarding. The purpose and satisfaction of my life made difficulties challenging and growth-promoting. I so, so, sympathize with slaves, because doing something not of your choice, and being ordered how to do it, and how much to do (never enough) makes any human being unhappy. That's how the cult operates, especially on the women. (I hear from the men that it is just as bad, and maybe even more coercive.)

One simple example: Send your 20-year-old on a mission? My cousin is deciding to force her daughter to go on a mission, or to let her accept a music scholarship to a good school, or to attend a great nursing program for which she qualified, or stay home and work at a job she already loves. All her skills and talents, and she is beautuful, and has a wonderful (non-Mormon) boyfriend, and friends, and skiing--and they want to send her away on a mission????

It's a no-brainer, looking at this decision from the outside, from our perspectives of being Mormon and not being Mormon. It really is a choice between happiness and unhappiness. (Overcoming normal adversities, or wallowing in fictional, man-invented adversities created to keep you down, keep you paying money to a cult.

Wow MWK....thank you for sharing your woman’s perspective. That was exceptional.

So are meth addicts.

Muh spiritshul teeth are loose.

Considering their reputation for murders that make national news, business fraud, and antidepressant use, plus some humdingers like Elizabeth Smart kidnapping and Mark Hofmann bombings, I’d say Mormons are kind of dysfunctional.

Due to housing situation I am still one.
I AM NOT A HAPPY CAMPER................(those are periods to accent)

The intense need to appear happy as proof that Mormonism is true stifles happiness. A stake president smiling 100% of the time? Seems like a front. Part of his job? Was the smile just best way to win the "Who's the Most Spiritual Game"? My highupinthechurch older brother has the "God's Chosen" expression plastered on his face 24/7.

Dolly Parton's song, "Love is Like a Butterfly" rings true for Happiness as well. Contentment. Confidence. Those can be states of being. Happiness, on the other hand, needs to land here and there just once in a while and tease a warm feeling or lump in your throat and coax it into a grin and then flutter off. That is the whole point. Coconut cake is dreamy but become cloying as a main diet.

The Mormons in my family have the happy moments too. What I have noticed is that they are not tied to the church and happen most often away from the church when Mormonism has nothing to do with their lives for a brief while.

We were happy camping at Mere Lake for a week with half the town. I was happy jumping out of the loft in the barn into a pile of hay. My mother was a great horsewoman and was so happy riding as flag bearer at the Rodeo and the Pioneer Parade. Church breakfasts and bazaars had lots of laughter and fun. Winks everywhere. Happy landed.

But at church, family home evening? My father being bishop eternally and having to be the example to the ward? That was the bitter that made you treasure the sweet when it landed for moment.

I noticed at at family gatherings in later years after the family had become extreme Mormons, that their was a tendency to find happiness in remembering the good old days. I think I was the only one who noticed that these happy times revisited all had to to with when we were still fairly normal before the Mormon virus got it's hold.

Done & Done Wrote:
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> The intense need to appear happy as proof that
> Mormonism is true stifles happiness.
===============================

Just Look how happy these guys are!
https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/BUh63Lx9sDki-C5jITRALLsX2HQ=/1400x1050/filters:format(jpeg)/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/18554737/1613826.jpg

Okay yeah, I know - has that creepy of a funeral-home staff - but truly, these pained forced grimaces convince ye not?

:-D

First time I've laughed seeing that photo. Too good.

There is something about Oaks attempting a smile that is just priceless, and, a little Muppety.

They look happy for the most part. Ballard looks the happiest. Christ offers on seems like a very tense and serious guy. He’s my favorite speaker tho.

happy90 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Ballard looks
> the happiest.
===============================

Being a bit demented helps.

It's a church promotion photo. Are you really judging the smiles of these soul-less creeps when they are on command? I'm sure they just said Cheeeeeze before the snap.

Done & Done Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It's a church promotion photo. Are you really
> judging the smiles of these soul-less creeps when
> they are on command? I'm sure they just said
> Cheeeeeze before the snap.
===============================

Though the mouth doth grimace,
the eyes smile not.

You are on fire today and have given me good reason not to be working like I'm supposed to be.

They're rich, and everyone caters to them. What's not to like? The constant attention would not be to my taste, but it's what they wanted.

What bothers me is the church's constant financial (and time) demands on members. When people get money, they tend to forget just how difficult it is to be poor and/or struggling. That ten percent makes a huge difference to lower income people. In many cases, it's the only way they can make ends meet, or get just a bit of pleasure in their lives. But the upper leadership doesn't care about that, why would they?

summer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What bothers me is the church's constant financial
> (and time) demands on members. When people get
> money, they tend to forget just how difficult it
> is to be poor and/or struggling. That ten percent
> makes a huge difference to lower income people. In
> many cases, it's the only way they can make ends
> meet, or get just a bit of pleasure in their
> lives. But the upper leadership doesn't care about
> that, why would they?
===============================

Yes, but ye be burdened by a sense of Humanity.

I don't believe Mormons are happy. Not if they have high religiosity and take the doctrine seriously. You have to repent for even every thought that you have. Unhappiness is seen as a symptom of the Adversary, rather than a natural emotion(anger is actually supposed to be a reaction to some boundary being crossed). So, you end up repressing every thought and emotion that is coded as bad or wrong, so, you never truly listen to yourself or your body. Or if you do give in, you constantly feel shame and guilt, pushing you to agonize over natural, healthy, human emotions and behaviors, so, there's this constant feeling of failure and unworthiness. Don't even get me started on those who are not neurotypical and the Hell they go through trying to fit the Mormon mold(which they are told to do in order to earn their place in the next life).

You're never free from the yoke of seeing symbols all around you in everything, God talking to you from a can of chef boyardee falling off the counter. Every bad or good thing that happens to you was earned and deserved. You are constantly waiting for the end to come. The world isn't just going through fluctuations and normal cycles of wealthy countries having more free time and excess. It's all literally going to hell any second now, so, you're constantly filled with an anxiety about the sky falling, because you were told it is going to.

The only Mormons who are happy are those who panic out here in reality n their own and need high pressure structure in their lives. And rich Jack Mormons who can afford to live how they want and still maintain a temple recommend.

No sad faces in the insane asylum.

My family wasn't in the "in crowd" in the ward as my dad wasn't very active and my mother was not very social. Three of my five siblings were inactive by the time they graduated high school.

I stuck it out. I wanted that forever family. Now my "husband" tells our TBM daughter that "you mother was never happy as a mormon."

I worked with some guys when I was in my 20s who were and are happy as mormons. And they are the nicest mormons I've ever met. They weren't judgmental, weren't holier than thou. They are just wonderful people.

One of my two best friends (both are mormon) is SO UNHAPPY she doesn't get out of bed any longer. She is on antidepressants and has been for years, but she is SO DEPRESSED and it all boils down to mormonism. I've known her for 35 years. So I know a lot about her history. She has 5 kids who are all very successful and have nice families, temple married, etc., but she can't get out of bed.

This happened a while ago and I think I told this story before. We went to Las Vegas when they were trying to be more family friendly. I went w/my kids and it was fun. But one dat we went into the canyon and rode horses. Our guide was really funny. He told a Mormon joke (cant't remember but it was funny). We had a good laugh. He said whew after I told that joke I got scared that you all were Mormon and would complain. We laughed and said we are Mormon. He went on to say he has been taking people out for a long and we were the first Mormons that smiled and enjoyed their time together.
I have Mormon friends and non Mormon friends. The common denominator is we like each other because we respect and appreciate one another. No one is "assigned". Life is not always happy, but life is good.

Once you're church-broke, you sometimes just walk around with a contented looking smile. You *think* you're happy because you have been told you're happy.

But real joie de vivre? A lucky few.

Very true. One of the biggest things I came to realize is, "Do I want to be the wife(one of many) of a god? Do I want to make a bunch of spirit children and have them not know me and be shushed to never talk about me? Do I want to live forever at all?"

I was told to want these things and got hyped up, so, at one point, I was so upset at the thought of not achieving those goals. ...but they're not mine. I only realized after I left, I was hunting someone else's dreams for me.

Yes. And, Yes.

I was told all of my youth that only Mormons knew true happiness. Because----wait for it . . . we had the only true church . . . and . . . the fullness of the gospel.

I heard it said that others only *thought* they were happy.

So me, after having absorbed this like a sponge big enough to make Ripley's Believe It Or Not, I based my whole Mission Farewell talk on this. We always said talk not speech I don't know why but then we lived up the crick so whatever. Farewell talks were a really big deal then.

I said I was so excited to bring true happiness to the people of Argentina. Had every intension of doing it for real, not like that hatchet job Eva Peron did.

When I got to Argentina I found most people were already happier than I was. Mostly because they weren't thinking about it, just being it perhaps.

An old saying, "Comparison is the thief of joy." True, that.

A number of years ago I was chatting with a TBM acquaintance. We were discussing the church in what I hoped was a non-offensive manner. I told her that I could never sit through three hours of church on Sunday, back when that was a thing. She quickly replied that for her, the time flew by. But sometime after that, the three hour block was reduced to two hours.

I guess Mormon church authorities opted for less joy in their week?

Underneath their plastic smiles, they are for the most part, very stressed and unhappy.

They must maintain two images: happiness and wealth.

Those who are able to do so, are constantly "keeping up with the Joneses". Those who can't play this game are covertly looked down upon, and deemed not as righteous as those who do.

You are expected to say yes to every "calling", and be grateful for it, even if you're called for the millionth time to be in the nursery.

I loathed every minute I was active in TSCC.

I had a calling with the cub scouts. One day, I got a call at my workplace; it was the bishop's wife. She was my partner in the cub scouts. She was getting on my case because she didn't think I was doing my best. She said:"we've made covenants in the temple and you're breaking them." Unbeknownst to her, I had gone over to the home of one of the cub scouts who was a picked on kid and who had refused to go to scouts anymore. I passed him off on several of his badges at his home. Did anyone say, "that was a nice thing that you did"? Nope. Instead, I got chewed out for it. Both of the parents were home when they had wondered if I could go over and help him and they were happy that I did.

One time,I spent my birthday painting scenery for the road show because I was so damn dedicated to TSCC.

Someone else called me at my work, chewing me out for not doing my best in another calling. It got to be that I dreaded going to work and seeing my phone; I wanted to throw it out the window.

I am sooooo glad that I walked away and resigned.

“ Antidepressant drugs are prescribed in Utah more often than in any other state, at a rate nearly twice the national average….
…. “In Mormondom, there is a social expectation--particularly among the females--to put on a mask, say ‘Yes’ to everything that comes at her and hide the misery and pain. I call it the ‘Mother of Zion’ syndrome. You are supposed to be perfect because Mrs. Smith across the street can do it and she has three more kids than you and her hair is always in place. I think the cultural issue is very real. There is the expectation that you should be happy, and if you’re not happy, you’re failing.”

Statistics don’t lie, but Mormons sure as hell do!

https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-2002-feb-20-mn-28924-story.html

When Utahns self report their happiness, they come in 2nd to Hawaii.

https://kutv.com/news/local/utah-is-the-second-happiest-state-in-america-study-says

>
> Statistics don’t lie
>


Good to know!

What do you suppose your stats (as in statistics) would show in a poll 'mongst "The Regulars Who Post On RfM"?

In what category(ies) would you score highest?  Lowest?

                               >
Because as you say, >Statistics don’t lie
                               >

So mebbe the meds work or they turn you into a liar

:-D