I don't know what kind of response I'll get from this - if any. It's been months now since I started this spiral. BIC, temple marriage - raised 4 kids mormon. 6 mos ago I started investigating stuff on my 'shelf'. Now I know it's all a bunch of bullsh$t. Knew a lot about early church stuff but not details. I had no idea about Polyandry - so messed up. I feel duped, lost and alone. My wife knows I'm having some kind of crisis but I don't want to hurt her. I can't go to church anymore cuz I feel angry there. Any excuse I can find not to go I will take. 50/50 split on wearing garments. Just reaching out. I do have one brother who I've talked to - but he's a 'born-again' Christian and thinks he can convert me now. I don't have the heart to tell him that I don't even know if the whole Christ story is believable. I might be turning Athiest or at least Agnostic. Oh God... or Oh science. How do I even exclaim anymore... geez.. so messed up.

First off, BREATH. Know you found a good place to land. There are a lot of good people here with a lot of different perspectives that will do all they can to help you. Be kind to your wife. Remember that she is afraid and doesn't understand what you are going through and chances are good she has no experience either. You are correct, it is a bunch of bullshit. It is not you. Your brother may be trying to help you but this is not the time to be jumping into another religion. Any other religion.

This is a really rough thing and it sucks. And it isn't fair either. But breath. Know this is a marathon not a sprint. Let us know how we can help you. Pull up a chair :)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/08/2021 10:29PM by Susan I/S.

Thankyou for your quick response! I do remember to breathe lol And usually I handle it ok - so far.

Many of us went through exactly what you describe. My advice is to slow down and let everything sink in. Keep reading everything. I suggest Age of Reason by Paine (short and to the point about the Bible) and Demon Haunted World by Sagan (about belief claims).

Meanwhile, step back and think about what you truly enjoy and value. Take your family places (preferably on Sunday) where you actually have quality time. Develop hobbies. Encourage asking questions and nailing down the facts when people make statements based on faith.

The whole process can be disorientating and cost you your family. The church holds the family hostage to keep everyone in line. Be the best dad and husband ever and take time to determine how you want to proceed. There are people here who ripped off the Band-Aid and others of us who took 10 years to dig out. There is no right way. Only you can determine what you want out of life, what you believe based on facts, and what is best for your family.

Good luck with your quest!

I strongly suspect that your wife and children are the people you love and cherish most in your life. Don't forget that.

And if this is hard information for you, it may well be hard for them too, so you'll likely need to be patient and forbearing as they come to grips with it.

Take your time and give yourself the mental space to cope with all these things. These have already been rough times, and having your worldview shaken on top of it is really hard.

Unlike the pressure from within the church to stay in, there isn't pressure on the outside to come out - well, with the exception of your brother, whose intention is less getting you out of Mormonism than into his faith. So there's no timeline here to rush into a new baptism or to convert to some new array of beliefs.

Just breathe and know that you have support.

Tyson

I just realized a few weeks ago how the church holds my family hostage. It's so criminal. I'm kinda hoping that my wife and I will exit out at some point - maybe even together, I hope. But that still leaves my kids. All are grown - half are active.

Tyson said: "So there's no timeline here to rush into a new baptism or to convert to some new array of beliefs."

I absolutely agree with this. Deep breaths, take your time. If it becomes necessary, tell your brother you need space and don't want to discuss religion with him at this time and you'll let him know when, if ever.

I'm glad you found this board. For sure, people here know something about what it's like to be you at this moment. Ask questions and say how you're doing and feeling, or whatever you want, whenever. On the other hand, you're an individual and your feelings and circumstances are unique to you so in a way there can be a lonely place, inevitably. Still, we're here for you.

It sounds like you and your wife can be a big help to each other and maybe you can take this journey together, each at your own speed.

All the best to you.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/08/2021 02:49PM by Nightingale.

Just slowly but surely be your new self that has a new reality that cannot be denied. Lead with class and dignity and love as the new you unfolds.

That's all I got. I kept it all a secret until it sort of came out in a big Ka-Boom. That actually worked for me but I doubt it's good for anyone else.

You don't have to choose anything now or ever about atheist, agnotistic, Christian, or Buddhist. Being uncategorizable can be to your advantage. The phrase, "I'm figuring things out," is a good friend. You don't owe anyone information that you don't wish to share or answers that you don't have.

The wife is tricky though. Obviously you will need to share when you decide how and when. Patience seems to be the best way to go. We've seen a lot of stories of a spouse following someone out a good while later. Best of luck. We all know it's not going to be that easy.

I like your thoughts on this. I don't have to decide to be anything. that feels safe, but not grounded - but maybe better than declaring what it is I am. I do have patience on my side.

casey Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I feel duped,
> lost and alone.

You were and you are not.

RfM saved my life. I've been married 25 years to a believer and it is better on the other side for me although going through what I did after an abusive childhood, addiction problems and "coming back" to church and marrying and raising 3 Mormon kids made the feeling duped even more painful. It was supposed to save me from myself and prove my family was what it wasn't.

We are here for you. Type away. Get the anger out. Lord (er Science?) knows you are some here who can benefit from it. When it comes it and it will come, I hope it doesn't consume you for years and possibly a lifetime like some posters.

Thankyou for responding. I don't see how I could go years feeling like I am now. Something will have to happen.. just not sure what yet.

From your other replies you seem like you are doing fine. I envy some people for whom their anger at Mormonism doesn't consume them for a time.

Good luck. In my opinion it isn't as much about freedom from the church as it is finding peace in not being fully fellowshipped by church people. Do I miss having my card and being completely united with my family and having a network to rely upon? Yes, but it empowers me to know that I determined Mormonism was false, abusive to me personally, and a big part of generational problems in my family tree.

Can't go back and take the other pill, and finding peace with that can feel good.

Ive had moments where I felt angry but for me it passes quickly. It has always been easy for me to let things go. For this I'm extremely grateful. Also, I've always had this feeling that a lot of the things I learned at church/seminary/etc didn't make sense or just didn't register with me. Right now I feel like I have this powerful secret that most people around me don't posess and whom with I cannot share or risk causing them cognitive dissonence. I don't want to be the cause of that.

casey Wrote:
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> now I feel like I have this powerful secret

What you consider a powerful secret I once considered an incredible burden. It was so painful I wanted to end it all. Looking into the beautiful eyes of my kids each in turn and telling them I wouldn't baptize them ripped my heart out.

I’m sorry. I’m sure I would have felt the same way at an earlier stage of my life.

I think what’s helpful when a person no longer can tolerate the church is to have some decompression time. Just go inactive and don’t make any big decisions for awhile. Give yourself a vacation from it all.

"Que será, será."

I don't think it makes any sense to buy or borrow someone else's roadmap out of mormonism with the expectation that it'll be your way out of the swamp.


From the minutes of a meeting of the 12 Apostle:

Elder B: There's nothing better for the church
            than a drunk apostate!

Elder O: Yeah, but thank Mother Mary that they
            didn't have smartphones when Joseph
            Smith was alive!



I remain committed to the principle that life should not be taken seriously . . . It's only Love that counts.

Spend quality time with your family. Do family things (every family has different likes). Go bike riding or hiking. Have picnics in the park. Set up a tent complete with somores.

Add more and more into the mix. Just don’t include church things. Each child and your wife will feel the love and connection. Ease them away until each one is ready for the real facts.

I think if you keep the unit together and valued it will help. TSCC will try to destroy the family unit. Build it strong before you are vocal about things.

Best of luck and keep coming here. Lots of support here and many views to draw upon.

You'll be fine now ..

Thankyou all for the kind words and advice. I decided I needed to share a little with my wife today. Just let her know I've been going through a faith crisis. Shared a couple things that I knew she would handle ok. 1 - stupid Word of Wisdom. (Every time I think of the dumb coffee/tea rule it makes me want to go outside with a starbucks cup and watch all my neighbors gasp)
2 - Polyandry, she didn't think much of that one which suprised me. We both feel that what the church is handling the LBGTQ+ community is flat out wrong. What's their church plan for happiness? That's right, there is none.

Some of you mentioned caution concerning my brother. Fortunately, I have a really cool brother who would never push anything on my. So it's good on that front. And yea, I'm not looking to 'replace' my faith with anything right now - or maybe never!

case -

Remember that immediately most members will assume you can't keep their standards if you drop away. "Oh, he just wanted to drink coffee and sin" is something we hear a lot. Then they can go on their merry way thinking YOU are the problem and not the BS they believe.

You can find much bigger issues with the church.

If you can, ask your wife to read In Sacred Loneliness: The Plural Wives of Joseph Smith by Todd Compton. Tell her you want her perspective and read it with her. Most women will catch on to what JS was up to using faith to get sex. Tell her you respect her too much to allow her to be treated the way women are treated in the church. She does not need a male middleman between her and God as the church teaches. My husband made a big fuss to me about how wrong it was that he was to know my temple name but I wasn't supposed to know his. You get the idea.

My husband used the women's issues to wake me up. If your wife is a reader and questioner who will listen fairly, she might see through things.

I started not believing in my early 20s and then I ended up getting married in the temple to my gay husband. I knew before. Church messed that up good. We kept going because what do you do? We were trying to figure it out. When he started cheating and was ex. sec., I went inactive. I didn't know what I believed. Coming here was HUGE for me. He had left and was gone for 9 years before I was told to come here by my exmo therapist. It changed everything.

The one thing I had was 3 of my 6 siblings were already out. My dad wasn't ever too TBM. I had a lot of relatives who had left. They went inactive. I was probably the first one who resigned of the whole entire extended family, but I had support from family and my ex.

BUT my daughter went back and we argued for quite a few years about it. I had to LEARN to not let it get to me, to not argue with her, to let her choose her own path. I got to, so she gets to. She married a mormon in the temple and I got there as they were coming out. That was tougher than I thought it would be.

This is how far we've come. She needs a new temple dress. I asked what she wanted for her birthday and she asked for that. I gave her the money to go get. I bought her scriptures. I never had any really nice ones. She does. I gave her money for her temple clothes when she first went through. I accept her journey. Maybe someday she'll find her way out.

Show SO MUCH LOVE to your wife. If she keeps going, fix dinner or clean the house while she is gone. There aren't that many good men to marry in the church after your get divorced. All women should try a singles dance before they decide to leave their husband. You might ask for ideas on what your wife can read. I suggest "In Sacred Loneliness" by Compton is it? He is mormon. I couldn't even finish it and I was already out. Pretty shocking. You have 2 kids out. How does she feel about that? Is she accepting? Does she talk much about her beliefs?

Myself, I CHOOSE to never be another religion. I can't imagine doing that. I knew I believed different than others in mormonism and I felt my testimony was MY OWN and I didn't share it. I still believe my beliefs are my own. They change daily. Not sure what I believe. I'm not quite agnostic. Someone here told me I'd fit as an apathist??? Spelling? No need to decide. I've been out a LONG time and my beliefs can still change daily. The years in between when I went inactive and didn't do anything but raise my kids is when it all fell apart for me. I had stepped away from the vehicle and the indoctrination fell away.

I'm so sorry about what you had to go through with your gay ex-husband. When I think of the things the the church/BYU did back in the 70's was it? to try and 'remove' the gay from these men it makes me very angry. I still get angry when I think about my sister and brother-in-law not being able to see my neice get married. They had a ring ceremony which I officiated at later that day at the reception. We kind-of made it look and feel like they were getting married - walk down the isle, vows, etc. It helped but of course, wasn't the same.

Thankyou for the advice about doing things for my wife if I don't attend church. I will definately do that. Probably start making dinner on Sunday regularly. She, and I, both adjusted to two of our kids not carrying on with church. They are still members, just not active. My oldest and my youngest both live with their significant 'others' and we still get together all the time and celebrate birthdays, holidays, vacations, etc. We just don't talk about church stuff when we are together. My wife also doesn't really talk about her beliefs and we actually haven't prayed together for years. Honestly, I don't think she really goes to church for the right reasons - socially really. But whatever works for her is fine with me for now.

Here is what you tell your wife:

Tell her you just can't go to church anymore, but you can't tell her why.

Reassure her that you still love her, and you will discuss this with her at some point in time, but right now, you are thinking things over, and you will talk about it when you are ready to talk about it.

She may guess at what is going on, but for right now she needs to respect your privacy.

That sounds like a smart plan loislane!

The last Mormon ward I was in the members were fond of a supposed Jesus quote, "I never said it would be easy but I said it would be worth it".
I have no idea when or where Jesus said that but at any rate I strongly believe that the quote makes more sense applied to leaving the church than staying in.
It's not easy leaving but it's definitely worth it.

I've heard that supposed Mormon quote. lol - I don't think Jesus ever said that. Funny how they just make shit up to suit them. I did a quick google search and found where it was attributed to Mae West which is just hilarious when you think about who she was.

Haha. I can't believe they are using that line. It *is* Mae West. All the great quotes from her and all we get from Mormons is "Doubt your Doubts". Geez.

Now that the Devil has claimed your soul, here's another good one

"Between two evils, I always pick the one I haven't tried before." Tickles me.

Well then maybe it was Jesus whose famous line was, "Come up and see me sometime".

Hahahahaha- good one

So when Bendar was talking about pickles....

My Christian friend confided in me that she sometimes has doubts about God's existence. I asked her if maybe she could talk to one of her friends at her church about her doubts, and she replied that "she didn't want to cause THEM to doubt..." Those pillars of Christianity must be on shaky foundations.

I sometimes wonder how much the Bible has been mistranslated/changed etc - or even how the stories were changed before they actually wrote anything down. I don’t really understand how anyone can rely on it for anything but maybe some inspirational stories.