Take all the active members in a ward, how many actually buy in hook,line, and sinker? How many are there for social connection? How many are there because they don't want to upset a devout family member?

I always wondered.

I have no way of proving it, but I strongly suspect that the “hook, line, and sinker” crowd is definitely a minority. I think most “believers” have found ways to quiet their doubts and/or have become adept at mental gymnastics. Many stay for social and/or family reasons, but lack solid belief.

It would be interesting to see polygraph results of people saying “I know” during F&T meeting.

Right, it isn't truly measurable but I think they're in the minority as well. Surely, they exist though. The mental gymnastics got old so quickly I have to give credit for people who manage it for decades.

You can never overestimate human stupidity.

I’m seeing a lot of people jumping out of the frying pan and into the fire. One disaster to a worse one.

You really can’t fix stupid. We probably will end up with a reduced population because of the stupidity.

    Coddling time seems to be winding down...

1 million worldwide

hear me out. i'm thinking you could get the number of true believers based on the actual numbers of people who pay tithing. they use tithing as a sign of the faithful

let's see. if they claim it's 15 million members worldwide, maybe 5 million are active which includes kids. that leaves me with 1 million adult people who truly believe the lie

another way would be to get the actual number of adults worldwide that go to the temple on a regular basis

That’s probably close to the number who would fall on a sword for the church.

they (tbms) seem to believe more in 'church' than Kindness, Honesty, & Respect for others; this is mostly due to Fact that ChurchCo assumes the privilege 'right' to define, un-define, and alter-edit all the definitions & applications arbitrarily as they please.

Witness that there are fewer absolutes taught ('gospel') then ever previously...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/19/2023 10:57AM by GNPE.

It’s about being on the covenant path. Step aside you gentile and make way for the Lord’s anointed!

I can think of several men who stay in because they know their wife will divorce them and they'll lose their children, and they'll lose their standing in the community.

The sad thing is I think a lot of people would leave but their whole lives are wrapped up in being Mormon. Their spouse, their work, their friendships, and their children's friends. If you leave, you lose all of that.

That's how religions get their tentacles into your life.

But I was lucky. I moved and left Mormonism at the same time. In my new life, nobody knew me as a Mormon, just another guy. It's so liberating to have people know me for me, not a member of a cult.

And that is precisely why converts have a much easier time leaving. Their entire social structure is not wrapped up in Mormonism. They have much less to lose by leaving.

I've moved a couple of times since I resigned. That totally throws Mormons off your scent. No more trying to make you a project. People are usually very surprised to find out I used to be Mormon. Even though I am a short walk from Temple Square, my name doesn't look remotely Mormon, and I don't look very Mormon. Thank heaven for small favors.

Before my Mormon FIL died he admitted he didn’t believe in Mormonism, the only reason he pretended he did was to placate his Nazi TBM wife, who he knew would divorce him if he ever admitted the truth to her. Which was ironic because I was married to his TBM daughter who had issued multiple ultimatums to me,”It’s either your doubts or your family. You choose.” And “If you breath a word of your doubts to the kids, we’re over!” (Wonder where she learned that?)
When our Bishop told me,”It’s fine for you to have these doubts, but if you share them with other Mormons, I’ll be forced to discipline you!”
I said,”Even my wife and kids?”
He replied,”Especially your wife and kids!”
I went home and put my already written resignation in an envelope and sent it in to the church and copied my ‘former’ Bishop.
I told my TBM wife if she expected me to lie to our kids when they asked me serious questions, she was free to go and to not let the door to hit her in the ass on the way out. I refused to live my life in fear of being divorced for being honest with our kids and have never regretted it since, even though I did lose my marriage over it, I didn’t lie to my kids and didn’t lose my family, just the manipulative members of it.

I think there are 2 million active priesthood holders at the most. Probably four million active Mormons and that number might be high.

My guess is that there are between 5 and 6 million active and semi-active Mormons, including children,

If just counting adults, I'd say there are 1 to 1.5 million active Melchizedek Priesthood, and 1.5 to 2 million active women.

The Church of course has excellent statistics on its membership demographics, and hell will freeze over before they make that information public, which tells you it is much lower than they would like.

Impossible to know who’s really active. The only way to know is to execute the ones who won’t deny their faith Roman emperor style. The ones who get fed to the lions are the true believers.

To them, the most important thing is the supply of freshly made doughnuts. Donuts keep the church moving along.

How many would speak what's in their hearts but don't for fear of a family member ratting them out

When I was at the Y and living in a 'real' ward, I have my first exposure to Jack Mormons.  I met more than a few who 'knew' the church was true but for one reason or another, they were okay with condemning themselves to a lower kingdom by being Jack Mormons.

...good times!

I truly do not get jack Mormons. They will aggressively defend the church, then ignore its requirements. I stand all amazed. And befuddled.

Ha! Saw plenty of that at BYU.

Here's my experience, for what it's worth. I believed but the last time I was happy being mormon I was 5. It just seemed a little odd and I never felt like I belonged. By the time I was 16 I knew I wasn't going on a mission, I just couldn't do church for 18 months. Finally, having a bishop say something that was so bad that there was no way that those words came from god was just too much for me.

My wife was a cafeteria mormon, She picked and chose what she believed.

That's all I can tell you, because that was just 1 of many topics that she would not discuss.