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Posted by: messygoop ( )
Date: September 29, 2023 02:27PM

The church has been updating its 1985 hymnal and 1989 primary songbook. Apparently, a church committee is reviewing some 17,000 songs which were submitted for use and inclusion of its new adult and primary hymnal.

Here's why I'm speculating why Praise to the man and If you could hie to kolob may disappear as part of Nelson's focus on Jesus campaign.

"The ongoing project is complex. Not only are the hymn and song collections being revised, but in some cases, individual hymns and songs are being revised to make them more globally relevant. Updates will clarify doctrine, replace outdated language where meanings have changed over time, and ensure that lyrics and musical styles are more universally inclusive."

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Posted by: dagny ( )
Date: September 29, 2023 02:50PM

>> individual hymns and songs are being revised to make them more globally relevant

Translation: We have to clean up songs that have too much Mormon history in them.

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Posted by: Nightingale ( )
Date: September 29, 2023 03:10PM

dagny Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> >> individual hymns and songs are being revised to
> make them more globally relevant
>
> Translation: We have to clean up songs that have
> too much Mormon history in them.


Ha! Exactly what I was thinking only you stated it more eloquently.

"More globally relevant" - Brilliant phrase!

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Posted by: Brother Of Jerry ( )
Date: September 29, 2023 02:51PM

I suspect you are right. Praise to the Man is popular not so much because of the lyrics. It is the tune that is a good foot stomper, and really gets the blood flowing. Since most of the content in most LDS meetings is pretty soporific, a good foot-stomper in a nice change of pace. It will be missed if it is dropped. I would expect some complaining too.

I wonder if more of the traditional Protestant hymns will be adopted by the LDS?

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Posted by: Nightingale ( )
Date: September 29, 2023 03:12PM

"Foot-stomper" - LOL!

Brother Of Jerry Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I wonder if more of the traditional Protestant
> hymns will be adopted by the LDS?

I would be thunderstruck if they went so far as to adopt from the cursed crowd, and even more so that they would do that. Kind of like NOT being the most correct on earth if you have to keep changing, especially taking material from the non-correct on earth?!

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Posted by: Nightingale ( )
Date: September 29, 2023 03:45PM

Brother Of Jerry Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Since most of the content
> in most LDS meetings is pretty soporific, a good
> foot-stomper in a nice change of pace.

> I wonder if more of the traditional Protestant
> hymns will be adopted by the LDS?


As soon as I saw the phrase foot-stomper (it always makes me laugh) I thought of the old hymn Bringing in the Sheaves (written in 1874). It's interesting to me how many ideas there are as to its meaning. I've always had the impression that it referred to $$$. "Bringing in the sheaves" as kind of slang or shortcut referring to making money (not so spiritual an endeavour as I imagined the hymn was meant to inspire).

Here are the interpretations, the hymn's words and a bit of music.

**Protestant Christianity below**:

What does bringing in the sheaves refer to? Interestingly (and predictably?!) there are many references and interpretations as to meaning. I like the 'spread kindness' thought and the metaphor about life's struggles and rewards. I do also believe in the 'reap what you sow' warning, although we all know that s**t happens through no individual fault all too often.


Here are some interpretations of the phrase bringing in the sheaves:

“…imagery to encourage believers to share the Gospel…”

“reap what you sow” – reminding Christians to sow at all times with faith in “waiting for the harvest”.

“Based on Psalm 126:5-6: “Those who sow in tears shall reap in joy.”

“Be soul-winners collecting a harvest of souls as good stewards of the Lord. Themes include “repentance, obedience, solemnity, triumph of hard work rewarded.”

“Spread kindness to others.”

"The phrase “bringing in the sheaves” represents the act of gathering the harvested crops after a successful season of planting and cultivation. A metaphor for life’s struggles and the rewards that come from perseverance and faith.”

“Compares the idea of preaching the gospel and winning souls to bringing in sheaves of grain.”



Here’s an ancient recording (Mills Brothers) if you want to hear what the hymn sounds like:

https://oldtimemusic.com/the-meaning-behind-the-song-bringing-in-the-sheaves-by-the-mills-brothers/


Below is a passage describing a basic interpretation of the meaning of the phrase (this is what I learned that the message of the hymn is).

“The lyrics of “Bringing in the Sheaves” are based on the biblical passage from Psalm 126:6, which states, “Those who go out weeping, carrying seed to sow, will return with songs of joy, carrying sheaves with them.” The song encapsulates the concept of working diligently in the fields, planting seeds of hope, and eventually reaping the bountiful harvest with songs of joy. It serves as a metaphor for life’s struggles and the rewards that come from perseverance and faith.”

“The uplifting message of “Bringing in the Sheaves” resonates with people from all walks of life. It encourages individuals to keep sowing seeds of hope, even when faced with challenges and hardships. The song reminds us that there is always a time for sowing and a time for reaping, and that our efforts will be rewarded in due course. It urges listeners to trust in the divine providence that guides us through life’s journey, bringing us abundance and blessings.”

I especially like to ponder seeds of hope and songs of joy.


Here are the words of the hymn:

Sowing in the morning, sowing seeds of kindness,

Sowing in the noontide and the dewy eve;

Waiting for the harvest, and the time of reaping,

We shall come rejoicing, bringing in the sheaves.


Refrain:

Bringing in the sheaves, bringing in the sheaves,

We shall come rejoicing, bringing in the sheaves,

Bringing in the sheaves, bringing in the sheaves,

We shall come rejoicing, bringing in the sheaves.

Sowing in the sunshine, sowing in the shadows,

Fearing neither clouds nor winter's chilling breeze;

By and by the harvest, and the labor ended,

We shall come rejoicing, bringing in the sheaves.


Refrain


Going forth with weeping, sowing for the Master,

Though the loss sustained our spirit often grieves;

When our weeping's over, He will bid us welcome,

We shall come rejoicing, bringing in the sheaves.


Refrain



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 09/29/2023 04:58PM by Nightingale.

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Posted by: messygoop ( )
Date: September 29, 2023 03:48PM

If you watch the old show Andy Griffith, "Bringing in the sheaves" is always sung when the Mayberry attends church.

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Posted by: bradley ( )
Date: September 30, 2023 01:13AM

"Praise to the Man is popular not so much because of the lyrics. It is the tune that is a good foot stomper, and really gets the blood flowing."

It's a ripoff of Scotland the Brave. Forget the tab's pitiful rendition and listen to this: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=xqeYKf8tdsU

Not to mention, the church can see the writing on the wall. Praise to the man indeed. They know he's not praiseworthy, and kudos to them for coming to that conclusion.

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Posted by: messygoop ( )
Date: September 29, 2023 03:01PM

One is written for the young women. "We are baking do nuts for our prophets"

The other is a special tribute number. "I don't know we teach it"

I have included special liner notes that this song should be played every Thursday when the Q15 meet in the temple.

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Posted by: messygoop ( )
Date: September 29, 2023 03:17PM

-I wonder if more of the traditional Protestant hymns will be adopted by the LDS?

Yes, they have already acknowledged that.

"These will include well-loved music of the Church composed after 1985 (such as “Faith in Every Footstep”), music borrowed from other faiths, and some of the 17,000 new songs submitted by members of the Church."

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Posted by: messygoop ( )
Date: September 29, 2023 03:26PM

Just an observation from one who has visited other churches within the last 5 years.

People who attend church love to sing. And churches recognize this and they allow people to stand, walk to the front or remain seated. And the pastor/minister/faith leader is NO where to be seen. They allow the choristers and music makers to have full reign of the worship service while they lead people in the congregation in 15 minutes (or more).

I know the church can't stand the mockery of not having full control, but LDS leaders must be envious of church attendees who WANT to be there. No use of coercion or guilt trips threatening members to do this or else!



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 09/29/2023 03:50PM by messygoop.

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Posted by: summer ( )
Date: September 29, 2023 06:16PM

Music is one of those things that speak to the soul. My school has a music teacher for the first time in...forever. She's right next to my classroom. I love to hear the children singing. The music is wonderful. When I walk into her classroom to pick up a child, I join right in.

I can see how the opportunity to sing would be important to many church-goers.

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Posted by: RPackham ( )
Date: September 29, 2023 03:34PM

I remember vividly the last time I was in a Mormon sacrament meeting about 1996. I was visiting my parents in the town where I grew up, and it was I think Fathers Day, so I went to church with my dad. After several hymns, Dad asked me, "How does it feel, singing the old hymns?" I answered that the hymnal had changed so much that I didn't recognize any of them, and I had been very active in music the entire time I had been active.

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Posted by: Nightingale ( )
Date: September 29, 2023 05:01PM

RPackham Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> After several hymns, Dad asked me, "How does
> it feel, singing the old hymns?" I answered that
> the hymnal had changed so much that I didn't
> recognize any of them

Funny that to your dad, though, they were "the old hymns"!

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Posted by: slskipper ( )
Date: September 29, 2023 04:50PM

How 'bout "Up, Awake Ye Defenders of Zion"??? Even the toned-down version is pretty appalling.

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Posted by: Heartless ( )
Date: September 29, 2023 06:04PM

I remember

Utah, we love thee
Battle Hymn of the Republic
All creatures of our god and king
Onward Christian soldiers
My country tis of thee

Were all in the hymn book. I understand things changed drastically.

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Posted by: elderolddog ( )
Date: September 29, 2023 06:41PM

> All creatures of our god and king


Page four, in the hymnal of my mormon youthful depravity!


I really, really enjoyed being a 1950s mormon.

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Posted by: tumwater ( )
Date: September 29, 2023 11:49PM

About the time the T's were descending.

Good times.

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