bother with.

I was wondering yesterday what possible explantation apologists could offer for Joseph Smith's polyandry. I googled it, and the results seriously made me laugh!

The answer? There's no problem with JS marrying other men's wives because the wives were perfectly able to marry one man for time and another for eternity. Really?? Seriously??

Not only that, on FAIR, they also said that since no one ever complained, not the wives, nor the husbands, there's no problem.

Geez, why do they bother? They are just making jacka$$es out of themselves.

Seriously.
Reading FAIR's incredibly smug and mindbending responses
gifted me with a one way ticket out
of cojcolds.
Well done breth'run, well done....

http://wivesofjosephsmith.org/05-ZinaHuntingtonJacobs.htm



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/10/2012 08:49PM by Makurosu.

Wow, so BY also participated in polyandry? I didn't realize that. I thought it was only JS. Very interesting link thanks for posting.

You should read the chapter about Zina Huntington in Todd Compton's book In Sacred Loneliness: The Plural Wives of Joseph Smith. After Smith died, Brigham Young married her all the while she was married to Henry. This business about being married for "time" and for "eternity" is a bunch of crap. One time Brigham got Zina out of bed with Henry to have sex with her.

The more I read and learn, the more I wonder how I could EVER have believed this crap. BIC or not. DANG!!

Makurosu, do you have the source for "One time Brigham got Zina out of bed with Henry to have sex with her?" Is that an interpretation of her cryptic journal entry in May '45 about her weakness and poor Henry? I'd love a back up source on that statement. Thanks!

I could be wrong, but I think he stated the source before the statement. He said it was in a chapter from Todd Compton's book...

My friend loaned me that book. I'd probably read it faster if I didn't spend so much time on here.

I just read that chapter yesterday and if I'd seen that quoted I would remember (unless my memory is faulty, that darn thing). It's alluded to, just checking for fact. If anyone can point me to a quote that would be great! Thanks!

I pulled the book and went over and over the chapter, and I cannot find the story as I told it above. I remember it from my reading of Todd Compton's book 12 years ago, and I don't know if I have confused it with another wife's story in the book or if I got it from another source. I should have had the source in hand before I posted and then referred to it by page. I'm sorry for sending you on a wild goose chase. I'll post again if I find it.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/09/2012 09:42AM by Makurosu.

lol. No problem, I'm just looking extra hard because I'm trying to convince someone that these things really happened and that it's not ok (way harder than you would think!) Thanks!

Parley P. Pratt also practiced polyandry. He was killed my an angry husband as he was making off with the man's wife. Parley believed that the power to perform marriages was not vested in man, so all civil marriage were not valid. He convinced the woman that she really wasn't married, and he was taking her back to Utah when her husband caught up with them. The Mountain Meadows Massacre was carried out in large part as blood atonement for the deaths of Joseph, Hyrum and P.P. Pratt. The MMM is just one more thing that never would have happened if it were not for the sexual depravity of early Mormon leaders.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ygLdN5l_uWM&feature=related
Bill McKeever is awesome. don't know if this has been posted before, this is the reason that started my journey out, i'm 5' 11" 215lbs. I can bench press 325 lbs for rep. For cardio I train in MMA. about 9 years ago in the gym. I put joey's story to a test, using a 90 lb dumbell while sparring with an assailant and jumping over a simulated log. in less than 2 minutes i knew i'd been had. Then all the BS started to fall in place screaming CON MAN

Well, IF he carried the golden plates. According to the other two stories he either a) used the hat trick or b) used Urin and Thummim.

I guess that really doesn't even matter because when you combine all 3 none of them make any more sense than the other.

The angel carried the plates away. Maybe the angel followed JS around, acting like a draft animal, whenever he needed them moved.

I read something, I believe it was in FAIR or FAIR Wiki, claiming JS having sex with Helen Kimball was appropriate, because she agreed to marry him and her parents agreed, too. So it was alright.

If anyone wants me to, I will look for the source...

Rationalizations like this just make me laugh. How stupid do they think people are?

and a 90 pound dumbbell has a handle. It's made to be easy to grab and hold on to.

Yeah, my LDS friends in High School were coached in apologetics like this, so when you'd try to explain to them why it was still messed up they just couldn't get it.

One of them has escaped and I hope at some point the other two will, as well.

stories MORmONS should have avoided telling

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=52XoDQL8lmg

even the profit should have thought twice about talking about the book of MORmON on national television

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wALvdgurB4

this guy wanted to be an apologist, instead he was just a dumb ass

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dCN3AvH4JRg

science always makes losers out of MORmONS

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dV1NYP60274

Some people can find *proof* for the book of MORmON everywhere they look , and those ppl are REAL MORmONS.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4BQrl4EZ07Y

Apologists just shouldn't. Where is the revelation of living prophets and apostles? There isn't. Apologists are a sick joke.

>As God's chosen one for bringing for the Restoration, Joseph Smith could sew his seed where he saw fit...

From the old FAIR board that has morphed into Mormon Dialoge... Also formerly known as MA&D...

Ha! I'm guessing they don't explain how the women having sex with both of the men during "time" fits into that time/eternity excuse.

And I seem to remember Helen Mar Kimball saying in later years that if she'd known JS intended to have sex with her like a real wife, rather than just have a symbolic "spiritual" marriage with her, she wouldn't have done it---and that she had trusted her father not advise her to do something that would be injurious to her.

It's also unlikely that anyone would complain when they've been brainwashed to believe their eternal salvation is at stake if they don't comply with the pervert's, er, flaming-sword-bearing angel's demands.

Mormon apologists are like the high paid lawyers who defend an obviously guilty defendant. All you can do is roll your eyes when you hear their arguments.

Please don't insult the lawyers...

In addition to polygamy/polyandry, apologists also don't have a good answer to the Book of Abraham. They will try to throw up smoke screens such as vague anachronistic parallels and arguments about how much of the scrolls are missing. But this all obscures a few fairly simple facts. Namely, that we have the facsimiles, we have Joseph's translation/interpretation of them CANNONIZED and . . . wait for it, THEY DON'T SAY WHAT JOSEPH SAID THEY DID! This means you either have to put your head in the sand and ignore it (which many folks do) or you have to believe that Joseph didn't actually know what he was doing since he stated numerous times that he was in fact translating.

I also was given a huge boost right out the door by reading Mormon apologetics. Inane circular arguments and rotten scholarship. They are worse than stupid, they are deliberate liars.

I love that, worse than stupid. Perfect.

Just puked--Horrendous!

Not that I believe this would/could happen,

but just for fun, I would love to see Joseph Smith and Brigham Young appear before Jesus Christ for an accounting of their lies--oops, I mean lives.

Ana

The purported justification for plural marriage is D&C 132 wherein it states in verse 61 to 63

61 And again, as pertaining to the law of the priesthood—if any man espouse a virgin, and desire to espouse aanother, and the first give her consent, and if he espouse the second, and they are virgins, and have vowed to no other man, then is he justified; he cannot commit adultery for they are given unto him; for he cannot commit adultery with that that belongeth unto him and to no one else.

62 And if he have aten virgins given unto him by this law, he cannot commit adultery, for they belong to him, and they are given unto him; therefore is he justified.

63 But if one or either of the ten virgins, after she is espoused, shall be with another man, she has committed adultery, and shall be destroyed; for they are given unto him to amultiply and replenish the earth, according to my commandment, and to fulfil the promise which was given by my Father before the foundation of the world, and for their exaltation in the eternal worlds, that they may bear the souls of men; for herein is the work of my Father continued, that he may be bglorified.

It talks about virgins. How can women already married to other men (polyandry) be virgins? The purpose of plural marriage is also stated as to 'multiply and replenish the earth'. Why then didn't Joseph openly conceive children with his plural wives? Oh, that's right, he just wanted to have sex with them, not have children.

Also, what's this requirement of 'consent' Emma didn't consent to any of this.

Tom

The rabbit hole just gets bigger and bigger. The more I study, the more I can't comprehend how I ever believed.

Leaving Compton's book out for visitors to see recently has just put a big bulls eye on me as a sinning heathen. "Lies, all lies!" is the common apologist retort.

Does anyone know where I can get a copy of Todd Compton's book. I looked on Amazon and it's not in stock. Plus, the price is $45.

I was lucky to borrow one from a friend. They are available at Signature Books, the publisher, but they are not cheap. You might try a library.