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: RfM
Recovery from Mormonism (RfM) discussion forum.
This was the breaking point for me, from a post by Noggin a few years back:
I have been turned on to these maps Vernon Holley did. At first I thought they were fluff and contrived. But I am finding he hit the nail on the head more than once or twice with the local namesakes Smith might have used to incorporate into writing the Book of Mormon.
(posted at FAIR by Noggin http://www.fairboards.org/index.php?showtopic=15025)
On to my next Holley map item: (click below to see the maps)
http://www.mazeministry.com/mormonism/holley/holleymaps.htm
Moravianton and Tecumseh (B of M= Morianton, Teancum)
Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Moraviantown
The Battle of the Thames, also known as the Battle of Moraviantown, was a decisive American victory in the War of 1812 which took place on October 5, 1813, near Chatham, Ontario in present-day Canada.
If I look at the map, Chatham Ontario is close to Palmyra. I wonder if it was exciting to be in Palmyra and be so close to major war event like that. A leading indian warrior and ally to the British named Tecumseh, was killed in that battle. It made all the major headlines. A city was later named after Tecumseh. Joseph Smith grew up near this quite famous battle sight. He lived the story telling at campfires. He was an impressionable 9 years old when this battle was fought.
Alma 50: 35
35 And it came to pass that the army which was sent by Moroni, which was led by a man whose name was Teancum, did meet the people of Morianton; and so stubborn were the people of Morianton, (being inspired by his wickedness and his flattering words) that a battle commenced between them, in the which Teancum did slay Morianton and defeat his army, and took them prisoners, and returned to the camp of Moroni...
So here we have Teancum portrayed almost to the status equal counterpart of Tecumseh in the book of Mormon. Lest you forget, Teancum as Moroni's right hand man, led many armies under Captn Moroni's command and was the one who
1. defeated Morianton as described above
2. defeated the Amalekites
3. snuck into the tent of the Amalakite king and threw a javelin into the heart of the king
4. threw the javelin into the heart of another lamanite foe... but this time Teancum died a hero's death after having done his heroic deed
Now, let's look at how Tecumseh died: (from the same wiki source)
Immediately Procter and the British turned and fled the field, many of them surrendering. Tecumseh remained and kept up the fighting. Richard Johnson at the head of about 20 cavaliers charged into the Indian position to draw attention away from the main American force, but Tecumseh and his warriors answered with a volley of musketfire that stopped the cavalry charge in its tracks. Fifteen of the men were killed or wounded and Johnson himself was hit five times. Johnson's main force became bogged down in the mud of the swamp. Tecumseh was killed in this fighting; Colonel Johnson may have been the one who killed Tecumseh, though the evidence is far from certain. The main force finally made its way through the swamp and James Johnson's troops were freed from their attack on the British. With the American reinforcements converging and news of the death of Tecumseh spreading quickly the Indian resistance quickly dissolved. Mounted troops then moved on and burned Moraviantown, a peaceful settlement of Christian Munsee Indians
Clearly the death of Tecumseh was pivotal. This paragraph shows the heroic death granted to this Indian. I am quite certain that this story reached the Smith family.
And finally, how did Teancum die?
Alma 62: 36
36 And it came to pass that Teancum in his anger did go forth into the camp of the Lamanites, and did let himself down over the walls of the city. And he went forth with a cord, from place to place, insomuch that he did find the king; and he did cast a javelin at him, which did pierce him near the heart. But behold, the king did awaken his servants before he died, insomuch that they did pursue Teancum, and slew him.
Teancum was the stuff that legends were made up of. So was Tecumseh. Many parallels. Easy to see too.
Tecumseh, Teancum; Moraviatown, Morianton
This is way too close to be coincidence. Does anyone else see the similarities?
I have been turned on to these maps Vernon Holley did. At first I thought they were fluff and contrived. But I am finding he hit the nail on the head more than once or twice with the local namesakes Smith might have used to incorporate into writing the Book of Mormon.
(posted at FAIR by Noggin http://www.fairboards.org/index.php?showtopic=15025)
On to my next Holley map item: (click below to see the maps)
http://www.mazeministry.com/mormonism/holley/holleymaps.htm
Moravianton and Tecumseh (B of M= Morianton, Teancum)
Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Moraviantown
The Battle of the Thames, also known as the Battle of Moraviantown, was a decisive American victory in the War of 1812 which took place on October 5, 1813, near Chatham, Ontario in present-day Canada.
If I look at the map, Chatham Ontario is close to Palmyra. I wonder if it was exciting to be in Palmyra and be so close to major war event like that. A leading indian warrior and ally to the British named Tecumseh, was killed in that battle. It made all the major headlines. A city was later named after Tecumseh. Joseph Smith grew up near this quite famous battle sight. He lived the story telling at campfires. He was an impressionable 9 years old when this battle was fought.
Alma 50: 35
35 And it came to pass that the army which was sent by Moroni, which was led by a man whose name was Teancum, did meet the people of Morianton; and so stubborn were the people of Morianton, (being inspired by his wickedness and his flattering words) that a battle commenced between them, in the which Teancum did slay Morianton and defeat his army, and took them prisoners, and returned to the camp of Moroni...
So here we have Teancum portrayed almost to the status equal counterpart of Tecumseh in the book of Mormon. Lest you forget, Teancum as Moroni's right hand man, led many armies under Captn Moroni's command and was the one who
1. defeated Morianton as described above
2. defeated the Amalekites
3. snuck into the tent of the Amalakite king and threw a javelin into the heart of the king
4. threw the javelin into the heart of another lamanite foe... but this time Teancum died a hero's death after having done his heroic deed
Now, let's look at how Tecumseh died: (from the same wiki source)
Immediately Procter and the British turned and fled the field, many of them surrendering. Tecumseh remained and kept up the fighting. Richard Johnson at the head of about 20 cavaliers charged into the Indian position to draw attention away from the main American force, but Tecumseh and his warriors answered with a volley of musketfire that stopped the cavalry charge in its tracks. Fifteen of the men were killed or wounded and Johnson himself was hit five times. Johnson's main force became bogged down in the mud of the swamp. Tecumseh was killed in this fighting; Colonel Johnson may have been the one who killed Tecumseh, though the evidence is far from certain. The main force finally made its way through the swamp and James Johnson's troops were freed from their attack on the British. With the American reinforcements converging and news of the death of Tecumseh spreading quickly the Indian resistance quickly dissolved. Mounted troops then moved on and burned Moraviantown, a peaceful settlement of Christian Munsee Indians
Clearly the death of Tecumseh was pivotal. This paragraph shows the heroic death granted to this Indian. I am quite certain that this story reached the Smith family.
And finally, how did Teancum die?
Alma 62: 36
36 And it came to pass that Teancum in his anger did go forth into the camp of the Lamanites, and did let himself down over the walls of the city. And he went forth with a cord, from place to place, insomuch that he did find the king; and he did cast a javelin at him, which did pierce him near the heart. But behold, the king did awaken his servants before he died, insomuch that they did pursue Teancum, and slew him.
Teancum was the stuff that legends were made up of. So was Tecumseh. Many parallels. Easy to see too.
Tecumseh, Teancum; Moraviatown, Morianton
This is way too close to be coincidence. Does anyone else see the similarities?