[anon for obvious reasons- currently live in US East Coast. DW doesn't frequent this board, but there is nothing here that I wouldn't object to her reading, and there is nothing identifiable]

This last weekend, I had a chat with my wife. She had been increasingly distant over the last couple of months, and although I had tried to discuss it with her previously, she was either too tired, or too busy.

I was finally able to get us both sat down together, and asked her how she feeling.

Her response was that she didn't love me anymore, and saw me as a friend not a lover. We have been married almost twenty years, and have two kids (one under ten). We have had 'ups and downs' with physical intimacy over the years, but she said that it had got to the point where she didn't like me touching her, and was relieved when she had her period. We started spicing things up last Summer/Autumn, and although she enjoyed the excitement of something new, she still had to visualise someone else to reach her peak.

I suggested counselling, but she didn't want that. She is now planning the 'exit' strategy. She says that there is no third party, and I believe that.

She left the church last Summer (some time after me), and this has given her a huge sense of freedom after years of being repressed since childhood. She wished that she had tried the field before settling down with me (she was just 18 when we first started going out).

She is a great Mom- her teenage years were significantly messed up with two fighting parents who should have split up years before they did.

She's been talking to friends about this for a while now. Unfortunately, I don't have any face-to-face friends that I talk to about relationship problems, and so, I'm venting/crying at you guys instead!

Arrggh, I'm currently experiencing all of Fowler's stages of grief at once!



Thanks

I'm so sorry. That had to be very hard to hear.

I feel for you...and I wish you and your kids all the best.

That has to suck. I'm sorry you are going through this.

I worry about this a little if my DW ever leaves TSCC. Sorry to hear you are going through it.

May I suggest before she exits you offer to open up the marriage?

It sounds radical, but if it just a physical attraction thing, let her go sow some wild oats. If you are treating her well she will quickly find out that the grass is not greener...

Takes a lot of guts, but what do you have to lose?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/07/2015 12:51PM by icanseethelight.

Or a trial separation period? Where you could date others and/or each other?

Openmarriages don't work.so sorry this is happening. I would suggest you seek counseling and go until you both are sure.

There is someone else.

Seen it many times.

Sorry to hear it.

I am so very sorry. I think that what your wife will come to find is that the grass is not always greener on the other side. The singles market is not kind to older women. But that is something she will have to discover for herself.

Yeah, but the singles market is very, very kind to single older males.

So there is always a positive for the OP, once past his difficult stage.

For women there doesn't always have to be someone else. She may have the hope of someone else, or she might just want to be alone and discover who she is. When I left my marriage of 14 years I didn't have anyone else and I've been single for 10 years. I've had boyfriends and lovers, but just enjoyed being independent and not having to answer to a man. Women who were raised in the church sometimes need that space to figure out who they are without a priesthood authority telling them. I'm sorry to say this, but you might be one of those typical Mormon marriages where the wife is attracted more to your Peter Priesthood than any real qualities you possess. The good news -- for you to be free now to find real love is a great gift! It doesn't feel that way right now, but I promise on the other side of all this pain is something so wonderful you can't even dare imagine it.

I'm very sorry to hear about your trouble. Some women who marry young feel as if they missed out on dating/romance. Even if she had dated more, she most likely would have ultimately chosen you.

One of the tragedies of Mormonism is that people are interchangeable, simply male or female roles/responsibilities. You have fulfilled your roles as parents... I do know that if you have done all you can, you deserve to be happy. It's possible that she may never be content with her life, under any circumstances. That isn't anything you can fix.

Even if you separated and got back together later, there is a hurtful history-what if she does this again...? That is a tough thing to live with/trust again. How can you ever sleep with someone who was heartless enough to tell you that they don't want to be touched? That isn't love, or kindness.

She will probably be sorry later, when she finds out the grass isn't greener on the other side of the fence. She will be worse off financially... Take care of yourself and the children. They will know you wanted to remain together. Some dad/teen relationships are closer after divorce (more time spent talking/interacting vs living under the same roof...)

Best wishes with your choices. Don't let her dictate all the terms of separation/the children... Sorry you're having such a bumpy road. Things will get better and you will be relieved without the pressure of trying to please someone who is no longer invested in the relationship. Work this through with a therapist, and do something positive for yourself, take up a new hobby or sport... Look at it as a new beginning. Good luck to you.

Ex-Sister Sinful Shoulders Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Some dad/teen
> relationships are closer after divorce (more time
> spent talking/interacting vs living under the same
> roof...)
>
Absolutely true this.

I'm much closer to my kids. We communicate, we talk about real issues. Whenever I ask them about what their mother said about this topic, or that topic, they say they don't talk with her much at all.

Another 'benefit', if you can call it that, from the divorce.

Actually, not wanting to be touched is exactly what happened with my mom.

She married young (17) and my father was 28. When she was 30, she divorced my father. She told me many years later that she felt like she didn't love my father the same way anymore, and that she didn't like for my father to touch her. My father was a wonderful man, so it wasn't like she was abused or anything. Something just changed.

She ended up marrying my stepfather, who was VERY different from my father and they fought like cats and dogs until divorcing when they were in their 60's. She said to me sometime before that second divorce,"I think if I had worked as hard on my first marriage as I have had to on this second one, I'd still be married to your father."

It's sad. Relationships are complicated. After my mother's experience, though, to me it seems like it'd be a shame not to TRY something, though, before actually divorcing.

Do NOT move out of the abode you share.

I agree. This could be construed as abandonment by the court. Stay put! -- and arrange for a consult with a good divorce attorney ASAP.

It's weird... Two exmos and the one who writes first gets the bulk of the support. what would we be saying if she'd given us her story first?

But I have faith (trust) in this: grief should be transitory, it should pass. As you move forward you need to plan for not only your happiness but your children's happiness and well being. Try to keep them from suffering too much.

If she's being honest about not having your replacement waiting in the wings, I think your prospects are good for keeping her as a sort of friend. Which is certainly better than feeling the need to hate her guts.

I for one, would be saying exactly the same thing: I'm sorry, the grass isn't always greener, and stay put until your lawyer advises you otherwise.

I do agree with a board member upstream that the wife, having been in one single relationship from the age of 18, may be feeling the need to stretch her wings.

What she is saying is that she married you under Mormon pressure to get hitched.

Now that she is more mature and out of Mormonism she would like another chance to make better decisions.

That's very similar what male posters write here on a regular basis.

You could try courting her all over again. But if that doesn't work you will have to accept that she wants to be free.

I also advise DO NOT LEAVE THE HOUSE - make her leave.

It sounds heartless but my brother made the mistake of leaving the family home instead of putting his cheating wife out and she ran up all sorts of bills in his name which wound up with him losing the property entirely.

Long story short - few years later he's bankrupt and now has custody of the kids, but not without them being scarred for life in the interim.

Secondly - your wife feels like a child who was just told they were adopted: her whole life has just come crashing down around her. Her church and the way she was raised (if BIC) has now been proven a falsehood. She may be suffering with depression if she does not want to be touched - are you on speaking terms with any of her friends so they could give your their opinion on whether they think, from what she has told them, that your marriage is indeed over?

Here's another thing to consider:

Are you physically changed from when you were first married? Are you less attentive to personal hygiene? Are there dental issues that have been neglected? Are you not giving enough attention to her needs/pleasures in bed? Do you handle your intimacy as a routine event to be attended to and then roll over and go to sleep?

Take a hard look at the situation with her eyes and see if you can't discern what may be off-putting to her...

FWIW...

Sorry to hear that you are going through such turmoil.

Have you considered going on a vacation alone together? Maybe trying to cuddle, rub her back, or massage her feet with no anticipation of sex? Spontaneous flowers? Writing a song for her and serenading her with a guitar? (If you can't play, you could learn how just for her). Taking her dancing? Taking her to see a stage performance?

From what it sounds like, you are going to have to fight to keep your marriage intact. Maybe start courting her again, as if you were just dating for the first time. I know it might be difficult if she's already checked out, but it's possible that you might intrege her if you do any of the above.

I don't pretend to have any of the answers, but I know that's what I would try to do if I was in a similar situation.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 04/07/2015 11:05PM by magicrocks.

It feels like you're damned if you do, or damned if you don't have a spouse that leaves with you.

If you leave the Church and they don't, they threaten you with divorce. If you leave and they end up leaving with you, things change in the relationship and they still leave.

I guess it really shows how much the Church has to do with some couples getting together.

I'm so sorry you're having to deal with this. I'm sure it was a shock.

I have confidence that you will find someone that you connect with much better. That dang church won't be the foundation of your relationship.

I agree with others that it sounds like your wife is trying to find out who she really is, now that she's free from such a stifling organization. Unfortunately it's not uncommon. She's coming out of a place where her role was defined for her and she was told what she should want, rather than allowing her to define what would make her happy.

I'm sure none of this is very comforting at the moment. You have to get through all of the rough stuff first. You can't go around it. You just have to get through it.

I wish you the best of luck in the future. I have hope that all will be much better for you down the road.

I also definitely agree that you should not leave the house. Tell her that if she wants out, then she can be the one who leaves. And definitely get a good lawyer ASAP.

Hey anon,

How are you doing? We're just checking in with some sympathy. Return for encouragement if you're feeling sad. There are some good joke tellers on board if you want to smile. =)

I don't know which was worse for me - finding out the church was a fraud, or marriage.

You enter marriage under the illusion that the other actually likes you, but turns out they just want something you have. When that something no longer exists (money, status, or whatever), many will call it quits. Especially those who with child-like fantasies that they can do better.

I'm sorry you are going through this, I remember from my own experience how painful this can be.

I agree with previous posts on protecting yourself and your children.

I'd just like to say, it's not over until it's over. I thought our marriage was DEAD (different circumstances) and I had no interest in working on it any longer. But 2 years later, lots of counseling for us both (together and separately), better communication, elimination of some bad behaviors and habits and I think we'll make it. And it's good. I didn't think it would ever be good again. So, if you're not ready to give up, don't. My husband didn't give up on us even though I had completely and I think that made me pause a few times and reconsider what I was doing. (and that is not to say he was a jerk about it, just consistently said he wanted to work on things and made real change).

Good luck to you.

I was married for twenty years the first time and I know the pain you are going through. I lost my wife, my three kids, my big new home, my business, and my church all within a year. She just did not love me anymore. What agony. I was broke, lost 35 pounds and had to start all over again at age 43. However, I never gave up. I soon had more young beautiful women chasing me than I had time for. I had all of the fun I should have had as a young man instead of wasting time on a mission and being a virgin until I was married at 23. I got a great new job and eventually started a new business. After 3 years I married the sweetest most beautiful lady any man could want. We have now been married for 20 great years and are very close to my children and grand-children. My ex? She is a bitter old man hater. My advice is move on. Be confident. Find yourself and have fun!

Has she always been so uncaring about your feelings? If so, tell her to get out and not let the door hit her in the ass on the way out.
What a bitch. You deserve better.

Of COURSE there is no one else! I mean, why would she lie to you, right?

May I suggest you visit the website www.talkaboutmarriage.com and the Coping With Infidelity sub-forum?

Wow, what a response. Thanks for all of the comments, and good wishes.

A few random thoughts as I read through the thread:

The strange thing is that I don't feel anger towards her. She is on a journey of discovery since she left the church, and I'm just heart-broken that she doesn't think it will be with me.

One element of the story that I kept back from the opening post is that over the last year she has realised that she is bi-sexual. A number of her close friends had always thought she was, and were surprised that she hadn't known it herself (what is the bi- equivalent of gaydar?) I'm comfortable with her sexuality, but she has wondered how it would be with another woman...

She admitted that she feels like 'a bitch' for saying the things that she did, and has wanted to say the things for a while, but couldn't find the right time to minimise the hurt it would cause.

Over the last twelve months, she has been seeing a Personal Trainer, and losing lots of weight. Ironically, for the first time since we were married, she now weighs less than me (I'm a good 5" taller than her, and a 20lb overweight myself). She is now noticing heads that are turning, which is a new experience for her. Doing more exercise is towards the top-end of my to-do list, but I feel annoyed that I've seen through her weight issues for 20 years, and now I'm the unattractive one.

We have never been the Molly M. and Peter P. of the ward. We were both devout, and held major callings at both ward- and stake- level, but never took the LDS culture element too seriously. If I ever tried to influence her by 'using my priesthood', she would either laugh, stick a finger up at me, or both. She has always hated the patriarchy system within the church, which was fine, as I disagreed with it too.

My main concern is for the well-being of my kids and my DW- after all, habits die hard. If the worst does come to the worst, I won't have any financial issues- indeed, I would actually have a little more disposable income (even taking a generous level of child support into account). However, my DW hasn't worked for 15 years, and I really worry for her. I still wish her every happiness.

I know several posters had suggested that she has already strayed. I'm reasonably confident that she hasn't. Indeed, in some ways, it would be easier if she had, as I would have a reason to be angry and throw toys out of the pram :)

anon (unfortunately) Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> One element of the story that I kept back from the
> opening post is that over the last year she has
> realised that she is bi-sexual.

That does make a huge difference to the story.

yes

But I didn't want to reveal too much personal information, in case anyone was able to identify her.

However, as the thread developed, I thought it needed to be included.

I believe her statement about the intimacy between you says it all. If she was able to calmly sit down with you and be honest and tell you to your face that she does not love you and that even touch is a problem, then you may need to make peace with that fact.

Work on an amiable separation. Tell her you still care and work together supporting children through the transition. Be careful of giving away the farm in any financial divisions due to emotional attachment.

Love can be found in the future for both of you.

It sucks. But your situation is far, far better than others who get into wars that destroy everything.

I wish my ex would have talked to me rather than leave divorce papers in the mailbox as she left to visit family.

Good luck and don't think for a second that you are traveling this road alone.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/08/2015 09:56AM by AmIDarkNow?.