A flare-up at the edzachary residence last evening:
My snowflake princess daughter, who hasn't darkened the doorway of a meetinghouse in years, (23 yrs old & still living with Mom and me) decided to start grilling me about how I could "do this to <her> Mom." What she is alluding to is that I have serious doubts about TSCC and mormonism, brought on initially by "The Essays" on lds.org as I have discussed in this forum previously. So here are just a few of the salvos I was getting last evening:
1. "Sure JS and BY may have messed up, but they alone will have to pay the price for their issues..."
2. "Some example you are being, Dad...raising us children in TSCC and then bailing on it."
3. "You've destroyed your 'celestial marriage' because of your doubts."
4. "Mom is devastated because of your doubts..."
5. "You're tearing this family apart..."

I wish nothing short of eternal damnation for the Afossils and Tommy Boy for perpetuating this lie that is MORmON, Inc. May each of them have a special season of rotting in hell for the pain and suffering that they cause. I absolutely adore my wife, but she remains convinced regarding the "celestial marriage" fallacy and, as of last evening, the guilt trips have officially racheted up to a fever pitch. So, this morning, I arose early and massaged my beloved's feet...I didn't say a word: I want her to know, without any question, that I love her beyond words and beyond any twisted, illogical dogma that MORmON, Inc. could ever possibly dream up...even from a magical rock in a hat.

I just want to let go and be done with this nightmare that is TSCC: being told how to live, what to eat/drink, what to wear to bed, what to think (or, more appropriately, NOT to think), what I have to do every night of every week, etc.

And a special note to Russell M. Nelson: how can a guy as smart as a heart surgeon actually believe this stuff? Come on, man! A glowing rock in a hat?? While the 'golden plates' sat idly by...covered, of course, so that no one could see them? Really? There is such a thing as faith. But where does faith stop and delusion begin?

Isn't it sad how most TBMs will insist that it's the person being honest and informed that is "tearing the family apart," when it's actually the ones who insist you remain in the cult or be cast out that are doing the tearing apart? Sigh.

I could offer a point-by-point rebuttal (such as her "some example" whine -- you're setting a great example by being honest and rational). But you probably already know those.

What it comes down to is that your daughter sounds angry and frustrated, and doesn't know what is going to happen because something is changing. That, in my opinion, is what you need to address as soon as possible. Hopefully without anger or blame, from either of you.

Best.

Getting the kids involved. Great, just great.

Just know you are in the right here and you are the adult.
Whatever happened to allowing people to follow the dictates of their conscience.

Ask them this: If the church is so perfect, why does it need to lie all the time to prevent it from collapsing? Doesn't it behoove you as the head of the family to unravel the lies?

I can give JS a pass on the whoring and BY a pass on the MMM and the Black Hawk genocide. But the BoM and BoA cannot get a pass because they are right here, right now, completely destroyed by science.

I'd start dropping subtle hints that nosy busybodies need to live on their own. Let her get out into the cruel dark world and fend for herself for a bit.

My thought exactly, only I'm not so gauche as you to put it into print!~

Oh, wait.....


--Gauche EOD

I'm not sure I'd be so subtle. As the head of household and the provider one should be shown respect.

Mormons are virtuoso at not taking into account what another person desires or how they feel. The daughter is doing the typical judging you against a mold and she has given you an F. This is spiritually lazy. She has no interest in who you really are, how you feel, what you think, what your reasoning. She just selfishly berates you for not being what she wants. Shallow.

This girl has big lessons to learn in life. The sooner she gets some hard knocks the better.

Sounds like someone's been working on your daughter.


Any RM's been hanging around?

“To what extreme will TBMs go in their apologetic efforts?”
Seriously? The LDS German Apostle of the Church has adopted (not received revelation for) and repeated in public the ridiculous notion, straight from the LDS apologist lips of Daniel C. Peterson that a rock in a hat worked like a modern cell phone!

1. "Sure JS and BY may have messed up, but they alone will have to pay the price for their issues..."

So what you’re saying is that if I was to marry children and send men on missions then marry their wives in the Temple you’d be good with that? OR would that only be OK if I was threatened by a sword wielding Angel? Or is my crime worse because I decide to not believe that said actions are OK with or without Angelic threats?

2. "Some example you are being, Dad...raising us children in TSCC and then bailing on it."

Again what are you saying? Are you angry because you stayed in a sinking boat when my example is to get the heck out or, well just what are you saying? The example should be self-evident. Ask me why. It’s not about you.

3. "You've destroyed your 'celestial marriage' because of your doubts."
You mean the Celestial kingdom kind of marriage? The one invented by Emanuel Swedenborg and not Joseph Smith? Oh you didn’t know about that?

4. "Mom is devastated because of your doubts..."
A normal human reaction when two people believed the same thing and one decided to change.
Just like the spouse that lost their belief after years of faithfully chasing Sasquatch who decided the evidence did not stack up and due to personal honesty couldn’t continue the chase that never payed out.

5. "You're tearing this family apart..."

Read Plato’s “Allegory of the Cave” Then let’s begin with a foundation for understanding.

Ed
Calmly and rationally and alone with the naive offspring explain your reasoning for leaving one piece of information at a time. Get her to commit to studying that single piece of information and then you will discuss that and that alone. Then move onto the next....and so forth. Don't alienate her by pointing out her lack of attendance. Keep this between you and her. Mom ain't knowing unless daughter tells her. If at anytime during your discussion she raises her voice, brings mom's feelings into it or invokes the "example" phrase cut it and tell her you and her will continue the discussion when she can stay on topic and be mature.
If she repeatedly brings up the past then you can learn what I have known for years..." Women never forget where they bury the hatchet". I would then immediately discuss what her plans are for living under her own roof.

Gatorman

Any progress my friend?

Gatorman

Dear daughter needs to mind her own business. If she doesn't have any of her own business, she needs to get some.

I would have a chat with spouse about dragging others into the middle of your marriage, be it, family members, church members, bishops sp's etc.

Nobody belongs in the middle of your marriage unless invited.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/10/2016 05:42PM by madalice.

Daughter needs to move out. Then she will be too busy figuring out how to pay her own bills to mind anybody else's business. If she starts that again I think you should refuse to have that conversation with her, period. It's none of her business at all. If she was married and you presumed to tell her how to conduct her marriage, I bet you would get an earfull.

Thanks, everyone, for the wise counsel and kind words. Good stuff.

I thought I was going to be given "the ultimatum" by the wifey, ("get back in line, or I'm divorcing you") but she calmed down enough to get to the "we just need to respect each other's differences" point. I'm okay with that: at the very least she recognizes that I'm no longer drinking the kool-aid.

The drama with the princess daughter continues. Stay tuned...

Now, I am a NeverMo and I am not sure exactly how this works. But couldn't daughter hang on to the celestial marriage thing for mom by simply having you dead dunked later?

Seems to me that this dead dunk thing is a get out of jail free card, no?

Ed
I see this as a positive. Blessings to you for your faithfulness to the marriage and its priority in your life.

Gatorman



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/10/2016 09:39PM by gatorman.

I suspect there is something "else" going on with your daughter. She may be compensating or feeling guilty about living in your home, not having outside interests, directions, goals and she is focusing her frustrations on you (and most likely others too).

The pains of growing up are many. We may or may not be aware of the struggles and issues our own children are experiencing. Try to consider the source and not take things she says/does too personally. Let her issues be her OWN.

When she lashes out, you might try not going on the defensive but just let her rant on. Smile (to yourself) and walk away. She will finally give it up and move her attacks on to others who will play the game with her. Her words (attacks) to you are meaningless unless you decide to engage.

Hopefully she will outgrow this silly childishness in time. By responding to her at all you are letting her meddle in your life and marriage. You don't have to be harsh but you can get the message across that she needs to mind her own business by simply refusing to engage. Sometimes the best thing we can do in our relationships is to give ourselves some time and space outside of them.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 07/10/2016 11:21PM by dejavue.