So a few months ago I was riding through BYU on my bike. This is what I observed as a tourist:

Everyone was walking really slow, smelling the flowers so to speak. No one was in a hurry. They weren't worried about being late or meeting deadlines, or getting to work on time. Everyone was collaborating and having a good time.

The boys looked rather dopey, a little on the nerdy side. Clothes from the Good will. And the girls looked like they hadn't combed their hair, just flowing everywhere like it was 1969 or something. The clothes looked second hand like they didn't care how they looked at all, Moo-Moos and flip flops. If there was a sudden snow storm, I don't know what they would do.

I picked up the official school magazine from the Wilkinson Center and the featured story wasn't on some important research or scientific findings that a University would want to promote, but instead on "how to know when to dump your boyfriend." The gist of the article said-- No girl should be second best. If he thinks your friends are prettier than you it's time to go.

But what is this place really like? Are these kids getting prepared to be leaders in an aggressive, cut throat, prestigious, ever changing economy, fueled by merges and takeovers? Perhaps they do well because they have good social inheritances and above average IQ's, and smart parents?

Is the school doing a good job, or are they just lucky?

The church leadership seriously believes that the only thing that matters in this life is getting religion right. Education is meaningless at best and a spiritual threat at worst. So they give top social control to the religion department at the school. The other departments have to pick up the slack and try to help their non-religiously minded students make some sort of sense out of life. The science and engineering groups generally are OK- except for biology. Biologists, along with the humanities groups, are so afraid of getting in trouble that they cannot fulfill their main goal as teachers, which is to awaken a sense of wonder and intellectual exploration on the part of the students. They can get fired for letting a student's facial hair get out of hand.

For Mormons, a major part of getting religion right is getting married. So major portions of the institutional organization is all about social success. Career development, especially for women, is second-tier.

Like everything else relating to Mormonism, it is all about image. Except in very narrowly-defined subjects, professors are watchdogs, not teachers.

IMO.

Yes, I had teachers that said "This is what the outside world teaches, but WE don't believe it. I say it because...you know...that's what the outside world teaches. But please, know that WE don't believe it." They would repeat this multiple times cause they can't risk it.

Visiting BYU Provo as a nevermo more than 40 years ago, I thought the students looked far too conforming and controlled. It was like their grandparents had told them how to dress, cut their hair, what to study, etc.

To me the college years should be (to the largest extent possible) about self exploration. Go ahead and wear short-shorts, cut your hair in a Mohawk or dye it purple, or grow it to your waist. Take a course in Women's Studies, fringe religions, human sexuality, or whatever else moves you. Walk into a studio art class and draw a naked model. Take a course in film studies that will show you anything that the professor considers important and educational. Spend the night on a friend's couch or with your partner without anyone giving a fig. And spend your Sundays however you please. As my family members told me once upon a time, if you don't do it now, when will you? The real world and its demands will call soon enough.

Its a meat market that scared the shit out of me even as a TBM.

I'm a byu grad. Unfortunately.

I'd definitely say that the entire BYU culture is very much all about looks. I always thought that campus was full of blonde, long hair, heavy makeup, nice clothes - type of girls. This was the ultimate BYU look. Funny, I'm blonde, tall, long hair, I like makeup and nice clothes, so I should shut up about it, right :). Boys were in most cases very unattractive to me. BYU boys have this annoying byu haircut that just screams "good RM, future bishop" to me. And don't forget the "turtle neck" type of garments they would wear, so all the girls know that he served a mission!!

And these boys and girls were in two different clubs - married and single. Married students were on their own. Seriously, they were the worst group team mates. Always full of excuses and acting like their busy married life had some sort of priority. They'd say sh*t such as "you'll understand when you get married, omg married life is the best, idk how it feels to be single anymore, I couldn't do it." Annoying as hell. They thought they won the lottery because they were married.Single students were annoying in a different way. In a nutshell, everything was about finding their spouse.

I regret going to BYU so much. Seriously. I know it sounds silly, but I'm sad I never had "the wild college experience." I never had crazy drunk summer break as a college student. I don't have any super memorable, epic college experience. Most of it was focused on schooling and being a good Mormon.

College should be about making memories, friends, spontaneous fun, self-discovery. Not about finding your spouse your first year and graduating with two kids. I'm very happy I never got married while at BYU. I can't imagine that.

Now what you mentioned at the end is very interesting - I work in NYC and we have a big branch in SLC. Two months ago we had a new SLC employee here for training. When he found out i went to BYU, he was happy we could form a little mormon group. He said that he wants to network with mormons and make good connections especially in SLC. I told him that in order to succeed, he needs to get out of his mormon world and network with everyone. Nobody important in SLC is mormon. That scared the shiz out of him. BYU graduates are book smart, but they're not ready to work in a world, where we accept and support LGBTQ, drink coffee, women are your bosses and non-mormons are happy.

"graduates are book smart, but they're not ready to work in a world, where we accept and support LGBTQ, drink coffee, women are your bosses and non-mormons are happy"

This is Right. Provo is a bubble and there seems to be too much emphasis on religion and hooking up. These kids are paying good money and seem to be more in a "finishing school" where it's more about learning the careful etiquette of living in suburban Draper, Lehi, or Alpine where most are Mormons and upper middle class, away from diversity.

But truthfully only 30% of graduates work in their college majors and many will likely work out of State in liberal places like California. Most of these kids would be well suited for working part time, learning responsibility, working with diverse people of different races and beliefs.

Maybe UCLA is a better college?

anono this week Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> Maybe UCLA is a better college?


Ya think?

Long-haired hippie, attended many classes barefoot, wore many different sets of beads, had my ears pierced (my mother was scandalized.)

Also had my first hangover. Great learning experience.

Roommates became friends for life, in most instances. I also still have a friend or two from classroom friendships.

My sweet DH always buys me something out of the BearWear catalog for Christmas. He has bought me both a tee shirt and a sweatshirt that say, "My favorite teams are UCLA and whoever is playing USC." He knows better than to bring anything burgundy-colored (except maybe wine) into the house.

The Sixties were a great time to be at a great school.

Goldros Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> He said that he wants to network with mormons and
make good connections especially in SLC.

I thought Mormon networking consisted mostly of sucking up to your stake president.

I know he's getting married, so he probably needs promotion and more money.


I'm 5'9

Oh. Thanks for answering. I hope you don’t think I’m too weird for asking. I just like tall women!

Well, I'll have to report you to the stake president. That's for sure :)

Can you email me about something off topic?
It’s hurricane83@earthlink.net

That would be interesting.

Now I'm worried :) Just ask here

How tall are you?

Graduates of the BYU are conforming, non-wave making servants. Covert government agencies love them for their unquestioning obedience and loyalty.

Graduates of most universities are on the edge of forward thinking, challenging the norm and willing to take risks.

What kind of person do you want to be?

"Harvard of the West" in the minds of TBMs. CULT indoctrination center/meat market to everybody else.

As was said in my short career at BYU "The campus is our World" and I don't think that's changed much, regardless of the sign out front.

I went to USU but my parents lived in Orem where I made some friends during the summer. They were BYU students and would invite me to various things on campus, where it was clear I didn't fit in. Everywhere I turned there were rules rules rules and everyone looking over their shoulders, trying not to get caught for silly, petty, pointless things. I was SO glad I didn't go to school there. But the fact I wasn't a student there meant the rule makers and enforcers had no power over me. For example, I'd come on campus dressed "inappropriately" and someone would get in my face about it. I'd reply, "I'm not a student here." They wouldn't know what to say or do because I didn't share their fears.

I have a friend who was born and raised Mormon and he told me straight up: BYU is like a cult.

I went to three semesters there (1 year), and enjoyed my experience there.

I did receive three proposals, one of who had previously been a protestant minister, and was more mature than the average student (he also was seeking a wife). (He drove a 2-year old Cadillac, so his parishioners must have taken good care of him.)

My most common boy-friend was a very good artist. We visited his mother (a widow) in SLC a couple of times.

His mother was greatly relieved when I told her I was not yet ready to be married (as she wanted him to serve a mission).

As I majored in art, the doors girls asked me to decorate the front of our building for home-coming. I was surprised when they chipped-in, and bought me a chain neckBless, from which a BYU insignia was attached (and which I still have--but never wear).

what is BYU like ? -mental illness !!!!!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cAWSGQMCM0U

I had a very similar experience, but it was not just that experience that made BYU so unpleasant

I seriously considered going to BYU after my mission. I am so glad I didn't. The mission can quite comfortably be removed as a resume/life-experience item after a few years if you choose not to talk about it to people. A BYU degree would haunt you for the rest of your life. I don't know which would be worse, telling people that you have a degree from BYU, or just telling people that you only have a high-school education.

Bobofitz and I are 1970 BYU grads, both from the School of Communications. I don't remember the names of ANY classmate I had and he doesn't remember a Lamanite dumbass classmate, so based on his recollection, we never met.

I had a nice time at the Y. It was very interesting there as an RM. I asked three girls out before I met my soon-to-be BYU temple bride and all four said yes to my request for a date. So I guess the RM trumped any potential liability being a Lamanite might have presented.

Only two things stand out in my mind about how out of the ordinary BYU is:

1. Females could not wear pants on campus, and their dresses/skirts had to be knee-length, which was determined by having them kneel on the floor. If the hem did not touch the floor, they had to leave the campus to go change. Standing in class registration lines at the start of the semester, you were quite likely to see this played out...

2. Being asked to pray for forgiveness for the sin of dry humping. You know, movie, ice cream and then making out... Happened to me twice with the same young lady. I know her prayer for me was wasted because I was not the least bit contrite.

I never attended a single devotional and because I enrolled in mid-semester, I apparently never made it onto a student ward directory, so the fact that I never attended a single Sunday service never came to anyone's attention.

Mostly it was a place to be, to do things that needed doing, and then to get the heck out of...

Hi EOD...we could have had a few good times if we had made friends there. Now, I’ve been reading all this stuff about how put upon everyone was by going to BYU and how restricted they were and how terrible there classes were, and how their teachers were not teaching the “ way the world teaches”, etc, etc, etc. well I’m calling bull on a lot of that. You know, you can only be controlled if you let them. Like you, I was fresh off my mission in 1967 and thankfully had a school that would let me in so I could get my 2S deferment. Because of my lack of study habits and my enjoyment of life I had poor grades my freshman year and they took me back because I was an RM. Now after checking out my student ward for a few weeks, I realized that no one cared if you were there or not, so I started skiing at Alta every Sunday, and so did some of my new out of state friends that I met by rushing a social club and joining Sam Hall, a campus club with a lot of fun stuff to do. I bought a TR 4, lived off campus, went to class, got good grades, went to Salt Lake on the weekends, kept my mouth shut about what I did and thought and graduated on time. It’s not really a big deal. No one can tell you what to think. I read Brodie’s “ No man knows” and it only reinforced what I had suspected all along. I never got married at BYU....but that’s the end of my story.

It must be much different now, but never forget, no one owns you.

Hi again EOD.I hope you realize that my comments were meant for the other responders to this BYU question. I fully see that no one can own your mind neither then nor now. I didn’t want to address each one of the complainers individually...too much.if you come to Utah, bring your clubs. And see what you can do about the fires in California....it’s gett pretty smoky around here. See you around.

Of course, I was aware that you were not counting me among the affected!

La Saucie and I will be in Orem and vicinity to attend my oldest daughter's 50th birthday early May of 2019, and we'll be meeting up with as many as will have us, including you, MeMikeYouNot and El Boner De Utah.

I will definitely have my sticks with me. When we play, I'm going to bring along my son, who makes good bucks as a coder in Provo, but just latched onto a City of Provo groundskeeper Willie job for a few hours a week, at minimum wage, at East Bay G.C., so he can play free golf there.

We are planning on having a very, very good time!!

Excellent. Your son is in the brotherhood of golf course workers now. I've been working at Nibley Golf Course in Salt Lake for about 15 years for the same reason. Looking forward to meeting you and your wife and son. Very cool.

I had a few student bodies when I was there - in the eighties - in Prove.

I never met a body that I moved that didn't move me.

I used to move my body when I was there. Now I move it here.

As a school, what's it like?

Like "Life In Hell" [the comic strip] (I saved a few from way front when).

M@t

Interesting observations. I went there a couple of decades ago, and as I would walk through the campus, I noticed that few people would look others in the eye, even the administration. I thought the students were introverted/closed, scared and stressed out.

I also thought the classes were sometimes crappy. I had MUCH better teachers when I attended community colleges. At the time I studied at the Y, the graduating students were teaching courses with no real life experience in their subject.

I’m so glad I moved, changed schools and didn’t graduate from there. I wouldn’t want it on my resume now.

Visited the campus once with a friend who was transferring to BYU. I'd never seen that many Mormons before. I just wasn't used to that. I didn't think I could take it.

I ended up at a small college in Iowa. Some of the rules there were tougher than BYU. No cars for Freshmen, you had to live on campus until you were a Junior and they had a curfew. But you could smoke in some of the classes.

Only three LDS on campus and one Reorganized guy "a real Mormon" as he liked to say.

Luckily I went to a top ranked university on the East Coast. But I've visited BYU several times with relatives. When my son started there, despite my encouragement, we went to attend "orientation" with him. I expected to hear things like how to use the meal plan, where to park you bike, curfew hours for the dorms, etc. But I was shocked and disappointed when the ENTIRE 90 minute meeting was about the "Honor Code", and specifically about not having sex while a student...rah, rah...you can do it. Freak show!

Yes!!!My orientation was 90% about religious stuff, 5% getting around campus, 5% lame jokes.

BYU is an LDS flagship, so appearances are all-important. This is why they sink a lot of money into the grounds, and students have to dress a certain way and be clean shaven, and the like. But the library was named after a racist, and the law school after a pro-Nazi anti-semite. The school itself was named after a man with plenty of blood on his hands.

As far as education goes, only the college of engineering made it up into the US News rankings when my kids were going there. The rest of the curriculum is all about validation of the Mormon religion. Some departments, such as the arts department, are severely controlled. Students studying art, for instance, are not allowed to study nudes, which is an art student's way of learning muscle curvature and all that. They totally did a way with that when I was a student in the 1960's, when, believe it or not, there was a ton more freedoms than there are today.

Some Mormons incorrectly believe that employers will see the sheepskin from BYU and think highly of the Mormon applicant, but it is not that way. Many employers are savvy enough to know that a solid Mormon believes in Adam and Eve and the flood, and they don't want to hire stupid people.

I've never been (came close to attending at one point), but from what I've heard, BYU is more of a place to find a life partner, moreso than getting an education.

That was my experience at the Idaho campus, before it was called BYU Idaho. I doubt it has changed very much, except In size. It might even be worse, considering the Mormon Church has somehow become even more backward and oppressive than when I was involved, in the 1960s and 70s.

Funny you should mention about the clothes and stuff. When I first got my yearbook from the institution now known as BYUI, I remember thinking the teachers all looked like they were from previous decades—mainly the 1950s.

BYU is pretty good value for money as US schools go. However, hand in hand with that you have all the LDS stuff. At my college most of the culture revolved around drinking.

I went to BYU from August of 1997- April 2000. Prior to that I was at Ricks for a semester in 1994 and the again for fall 1996/ spring 1997.

The schools are a joke. I got my BS in zoology and biochemistry and I can say I didn’t get a real education till I got my MS degree in environmental management from the University of San Francisco.

I studied hard at BYU but the pressure to marry was ridiculous. I couldn’t go on a date without that in the back of my mind. Lucky for me I started dating a nevermo girl after my first year at BYU and got all of the “benefits” of marriage with none of the commitments. When I graduated I bailed and do my level best not look back.

Every time I go near that campus my skin crawls.