Try belgian wheat, pilsners, or a good fruit hefenweizen. Very drinkable and enjoyable. Some would say delicious to the taste and very desirable.
Forum: Recovery Board

I have witnessed three baptisms in the past year. One was an elderly gentleman who joined after his TBM wife passed away and the ward really reached out to him and gave him a social home. I guess being a mormon was better than being alone. The second was the teenage daughter of an inactive mormon. She heard the discussions when she moved in with her grandparents and could not live with
Forum: Recovery Board

I have seen two book of mormon testimonies on my FB feed. I am quite surprised at the lack of response given the TBMness of my family and friends.
Forum: Recovery Board

Bad: Vanilla culture. There is no local personality. I know this strategy works for McDonalds, but really?
Forum: Recovery Board

Tail end boomer.
Forum: Recovery Board

My friend was very closed lipped about what he knew. I did ask and he never disclosed anything of substance. I am pretty sure what I have shared here he would not have considered of substance. But clearly I did. It shows control and intentional manipulation on part of the church to continue to hide what it is doing from everyone. Including other prophets.
Forum: Recovery Board

They are probably counting on the kids being born in the church from active members. Hence the push for younger missionary age with the hopes they can at least keep some level of activity as older adults. Who knows. I don't see the church ever being a vibrant living organization in the future. It has become a corporation in the worst sense of that idea. Beuracracy for business sake at its
Forum: Recovery Board

First presidency (3), presiding bishopric (3), Senior financial officer/staff (2) There is a meeting once a year where the full books are reviewed by these 8 people. It was interesting that the new presiding bishop (stevenson) didn't realize this when he was first called and had planned to be out of town on that particular day when this annual meeting was to occur. They had to inform him
Forum: Recovery Board

I know personally one of the 8 people who know the full financial picture of the church. The only people who know everything include the first presidency, the presiding bishopric and two administrative leaders. My friend was very clear that not even the Q 12 get the entire picture. Yes they participate in the council of the disposition of tithes. But that is not all of the church's money.
Forum: Recovery Board

From my nieces and nephew's mission letters, it looks like these are the kind of people who are being attracted to (deceived into) the church these days: - People in need of economic support (lots of references to trailer parks and out of work). - People with cognitive disabiltiies (some references to elderly with dimentia issues). - People with social needs (multiple references to being
Forum: Recovery Board

Here is the quote and it did not include technology, but scholarship. "The dangers I speak of come from the gay-lesbian movement, the feminist movement (both of which are relatively new), and the ever-present challenge from the so-called scholars or intellectuals." (Talk to the All-Church Coordinating Council, May 18, 1993).
Forum: Recovery Board

The bishop's first charge is to protect the church and its members. Even if a bishop has told you that he will keep something confidential, many, if not most, bishops will divulge those confidences to the SP, the BP's counselors and the ward council in a heart beat. I have been there when this has happened and I have called him out on it. They only value the church first. Everyone else ca
Forum: Recovery Board

Words to live by!
Forum: Recovery Board

So he is saying reality is so complex it is evident that there must be a creator. Return question: God would be even more complex than creation. Who then created God? If God requires no creator, then why would the world?
Forum: Recovery Board

How is the $10,000 beings spent over the next 2 years on the mission, not OVERPAYING his tithing? And they are quibbling over a couple hundered extra bucks. Pharisees!!!
Forum: Recovery Board

zenmaster Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > > > funny comment from article: > > "Its selective prosecution. When the British > Governement calls up the Archbishop of Cantabury > to answer on fraud charges, lets talk." That comment is telling in some ways. Is the commenter recognizing that all religions lie, so why just p
Forum: Recovery Board

The church article actually doesn't deny that we believe that we will become Gods with the ability to create planets. It says this: "Latter-day Saints’ doctrine of exaltation is often similarly reduced in media to a cartoonish image of people receiving their own planets." Again, the church is just trying to muddy the water and not be open and honest. Clearly the news artic
Forum: Recovery Board

I will gladly be in line to dance on the grave of tscc. Money just has a great ability to linger on for a long time. As you know. You can buy anything in this world with money. Even longevity. :-)
Forum: Recovery Board

The church I grew up with no longer exists and is dead. Correlation killed it. Corporate hierarchy killed it. Demands for obedience killed it. The corporation, however, will live on. They have just stolen too much money to disappear. Corporations always find a way to continue on. Especially when you have billions in the bank.
Forum: Recovery Board

Loved the honesty! The missionaries covering our stake teach about 3 lessons a week. Can't say I am sad. What a waste of time.
Forum: Recovery Board

Do you really want to have this conversation? Do you think they have answers that are real and true? If you want to find the truth, I would put them on the spot. Have them boldly declare and define one of the church's truth claims. For example, a prophet will never lead us astray or the book of mormon is true. Have them boldly define what those things mean. Once they have done this
Forum: Recovery Board

I honor Epi's choice that works for him. I honor your choice that works for you. I honor my choice that works for me. I am glad we don't all have to walk the same path. What would be sacrified? Our authenticity to ourselves if we had to follow only one "right" path. It doesn't exist.
Forum: Recovery Board

The current rescue report being used by my stake has this instruction from the area authority. "Please focus your efforts on who needs an ordinance. Please have your bishops use this report in ward councils and other settings as they focus their efforts on reactivation and fellowship.” I am not sure what the shift to conversion would mean in a practical way. Baptisms? Spiritual
Forum: Recovery Board

This whopper was taught last week in priesthood from the Lorenzo Snow manual. "When Joseph Smith received his divine calling, he was a pure, sincere, honest young man. Joseph Smith, whom God chose to establish this work, was poor and uneducated, and belonged to no popular denomination of Christians. He was a mere boy, honest, full of integrity, unacquainted with the trickery, cunning a
Forum: Recovery Board

It's amazing that scott howard is advocating the characteristics of a cult (i.e., organization with significant behavior controls). The military is one of those types of organizations that mimic the behavioral controls prevelant in cults. Why is it that mormons value obedience more than any other virtue?
Forum: Recovery Board

I consider myself a NOM (new order mormon). The definition to me is someone who is still engaged with the church for whatever reason (my activity is because of a believing spouse), but who do not believe much or any of the church's truth claims. Best wishes.
Forum: Recovery Board

I have been interested in the few threads going on right now about people talking to church leaders (SPs and GAs) about their disaffection from the church. The tone of the threads has included advice to be very prepared with your issues and arguments against the church. That got me wondering. Is US raising issues and concerns to faithful leaders really the right approach? In any negotia
Forum: Recovery Board

Uchtdorf is one man spitting into the wind. Even though I like his approach, there are 14 other men who clearly showed us in GC that they don't want to be quite so forthcoming. The organization will protect itself at any cost. Being more open with the mistakes that were made and being open and honest with the problems with its truth claims will only happen if the organization can get som
Forum: Recovery Board

I lived most of my adult life outside of Utah, even though I live here now. As a TBM I was always comfortable in my mormon skin. I didn't go out and preach to anybody, but I didn't shy away from my mormonism. So I had the chance to have quite a few conversations about beliefs, faith, crazy questions with many of my neighbors and co-workers. But I was definitely not worried about "sa
Forum: Recovery Board

Missions are funded from at least three sources: Source #1 - Donations from the missionary, family members, or friends. This is $400 per month right now for the young missionaries. Not senior missionaries. Source #2 - Members donate to the general missionary fund to help defray any deficits. The current cost per missionary in the U.S. for the church is actually about $500 per missionary.
Forum: Recovery Board