Both Richard Packham and I responded to you about this issue on the other thread. Please refer back to that or read http://exmormon.org/phorum/read.php?2,1657891,1657898#msg-1657898 If that's not good enough for you, then fine, but I'll bet you're in the minority here on that opinion.
Forum: Recovery Board

It's worse than that. Look at the timeline. 22 Sept 1827 – claims to get the plates Feb 1828 – Martin Harris takes "caractors" to Charles Anthon 12 April to 14 June 1828 – writes Book of Lehi June 1828 – Harris loses 116 pages June 1828 – JS applies to join Methodists but is rejected Smith tried to hook up with the Methodist Church nine months AFTER he supposedly rec
Forum: Recovery Board

Yesterday, in a now-deleted thread, an RFM poster (not me) called on a lurking TBM to address a few doctrinal issues from the essays. Since those kinds of debates violate board rules, the entire discussion was quickly shut down, but not before TBM lurker responded with the usual lame defenses. Evasions. "I think your question is bogus, so I'm not going to get into it." Denials, do
Forum: Recovery Board

"they said I was very intelligent and that they are my fan. On one hand that could be seen as their sales technique" Yes, that's exactly what it is. See Summer's post above about "building relationships of trust." "If I could have met them again maybe I would maybe take the Gospel of the Flying Spaghetti Monster to show them and explain how this is really nice and
Forum: Recovery Board

Adding my tuppence to the pile… Those missionaries have only one objective in their lives, and that is to sell Mormonism to anyone they encounter. The Mormon church is, quite frankly, a cult – severely authoritarian, highly controlling, and demanding, much like the Jehovah's Witnesses. At this stage of their lives, they're locked into an even more restrictive, totalitarian system, a cul
Forum: Recovery Board

Bruce, please take a look at this older post of mine. It has "faithful" sources and quotes that specifically say that JS married other women during his lifetime. Not the essays, but TBMs can't argue with them. http://exmormon.org/phorum/read.php?2,1587225,1587300#msg-1587300
Forum: Recovery Board

He could set my long Joseph Smith poem to music. Since I've already taken care of the lyrics, all he has to do is come up with a catchy tune.
Forum: Recovery Board

"When I first told my boyfriend about it, he cried. He asked if I was really open to God and was not even giving the Church a chance to prove it was true." Ouch. That's not a great start. Sounds like he's a full-on TBM, to cry about a GF's lack of belief. (Was he trying to manipulate you? Were they real tears or Eyring tears?) And to ask if you were giving the church a chance… you'
Forum: Recovery Board

"I'm still friends with some people in the church but for some reason they don't speak to me a lot. Sometimes they do but not often." It's called shunning. Your "friends" are programmed to withhold their friendship in cases like yours. The idea is to make you miss their company so much that you'll do anything to get it back – such as attend church. It's a common tactic us
Forum: Recovery Board

The story that Richards recounted in "Israel! Do You Know?" was also published in "Signs of the Times" (pp. 227-29) by Joseph Fielding Smith. It was given a particular Mormon spin. Here it is in its entirety. "There are some interesting stories told of divine intervention in behalf of the Jews during these days of bitter opposition and open warfare. While we cannot vou
Forum: Recovery Board

"people who think the worse of your life choices and expect/hope for you to be miserable" "They will only be happy when life isn't going well for us and all the good news would be disappointing to them." That was actually the point of my suggestion – that you make sure they know how well your lives are going, and how much success you're having, outside the church. They
Forum: Recovery Board

I think you should NOT cut off the sibs. You know they're reporting on you, so you can turn this around back on all of them, and maybe plant some seeds in the process. Manage the message to your advantage. Tell them about the positive, happy stuff, how good your lives are without the church. "DH just got a raise and promotion!" "Our vacation to Hawaii was wonderful! We wou
Forum: Recovery Board

Does President Dipshit not understand that you have so far been relatively restrained in your FB posts? Can he not see that his kangaroo court will free you to post material far more damning and damaging to the cult, including (if you desire) transcripts and/or detailed summaries of the excom hearing itself? The arrogance of TSCC and its tinpot tyrants continues to amaze. And they accuse us of
Forum: Recovery Board

Some TBM decides to show up, pretending to be a regular RFM poster, and announces that the church is the place to be after all. The username is always brand new, never used before. No way to check up on prior posts. Two from last year, just like this one, no material difference. http://exmormon.org/phorum/read.php?2,1521834 http://exmormon.org/phorum/read.php?2,1646256
Forum: Recovery Board

"The discussions just seem sexually kinky. What kind of a freeky church puts a gal through this?" Oh, it's not just a freaky church. It's an oppressive, totalitarian cult. The discussions are kinky because the sick bastards running the show are getting off from listening to them and by making you grovel before their exalted majesties. Really, you're too good for this kind of treat
Forum: Recovery Board

Your SP is an ass and a pervert. A little man with no real authority but a huge ego on a power trip. One who gleefully engages in what the D&C calls "unrighteous dominion." The reason you're upset is not because you didn't fully confess. You did the right thing by not confessing; had you done so, your life right now would be much worse than it is, because you would be facing hars
Forum: Recovery Board

It gets even better – and by "better," of course, I mean worse. Bruce R. McConkie, the gift that keeps on giving, wrote this in Mormon Doctrine. Note that this is from the 2nd edition; it had not been scrubbed from the infamous 1st edition. Bruce R. McConkie, "Mormon Doctrine," p. 616, RACES OF MEN: "All races of men stem from certain common ancestors. Adam a
Forum: Recovery Board

You have a couple of things in your favor. First, your stated intention to delay children. If you think it's bad now, it would be a hundred times worse with kids. Second, that you married out of the temple. You made your promises to each other instead of to the church. What now? IMO you must find out whether she loves you more than the church. If the church comes first, that's something you ne
Forum: Recovery Board

"because he really thinks it was impossible that a 14 year old boy could have written the book of Mormon without god's help" I apologize if this comes off as rude, but… does your husband even know how to add and subtract? JS was 14 at the time of his phony 1st Vision. The BOM came *ten years* after that. Why do Mormons think that JS didn't age during that time span, and he was s
Forum: Recovery Board

I was in a similar situation. This was a long time ago, back when telephones had dials and blacks didn't have the priesthood, but some things never change. There were maybe 3-4 Mormons in my suburban Los Angeles high school. And since the others were in different grades or different classes, I didn't hang out with any of them. As far as I was concerned, then, I might as well have been the only
Forum: Recovery Board

It shows up in the Bible; Joseph Smith recognized it as a good way to get a pliable, submissive group of followers, liked it, and ran with it. Scripture Chase time! Psalms 34:18 The LORD nigh unto them that are of a broken heart; and saveth such as be of a contrite spirit. 2 Nephi 2:7 Behold, he offereth himself a sacrifice for sin, to answer the ends of the law, unto all those who ha
Forum: Recovery Board

I'm sorry, but there really is no way to prevent it through political means or the courts. This subject comes up every so often. A thread will show up, complaining about proxy ordinances, and how "someone" should sue the church to stop it. Of course, nothing ever happens. Think about it. Let's say you were somehow able to persuade a judge or magistrate to ban the practice. Those offi
Forum: Recovery Board

Let those with eyes, see; and those with ears, hear. There once was a doctor in the land of Mo, Who heard countless tales of sorrow and woe. Suffering ills of the heart, soul and brain, From the high to the low, all in terrible pain. Then someone came in whom he'd not seen before And he knew that he just had to hear and learn more. So when they were introduced more or less formal
Forum: Recovery Board

"She won't go to get yearly exams or mammograms because she thinks she's blessed/protected by the promises in her Patriarchal Blessing." You can remind her that even prophets and apostles go to doctors. When Spencer Kimball got throat cancer, he didn't simply get a blessing and pray a lot. No, he got operated on, and had most of his vocal cords removed. Later, when his heart was givi
Forum: Recovery Board

Tevai, I think the sermon you're remembering is "Sinners in the Hands of an Angry God" by Jonathan Edwards. Here's an especially fun part: "The God that holds you over the pit of hell like some spider or loathsome insect over a fire, abhors you and is dreadfully provoked. His wrath burns like fire and he considers you worthy of nothing else but fuel for the fire. His holy eye
Forum: Recovery Board

They're not being benevolent. "I had a lady chastise me for not being in Institute. And people always make comments about why I'm not in the singles ward, etc." Here are a couple of my standard responses for people like that: 1. "Go tell someone who cares what you think." 2. "That would bother me if I actually respected your opinions." Mormons aren't accus
Forum: Recovery Board

Anne, the church will still be there in a year, two years, five years. Ask yourself why the missionaries are so anxious to baptize you NOW. It's because they are salespeople, and they want to make a sale and please their own bosses. Also, they know that the longer you wait, the greater chance there is for you to discover that you don't need their product after all. Why would a God, supposedly
Forum: Recovery Board

"can someone tell me other things about the LDS church that are a negative?" Oh yes. Yes, we can. Anne, congratulations for having the presence of mind to come here and ask questions from people who have been there and done that. The missionaries (I too was one, many years ago) would throw a fit if they knew you were here. They will say that we are liars and tools of Satan. The
Forum: Recovery Board

Thanks for forwarding on the Will Bagley note. I knew it would be important due to her historical significance. It was a genuinely exciting find for me. I'm glad to know that the appropriate people are aware of it now, and that it's out there for good. The church, of course, would have preferred it never be found, and there was a minor Wiki skirmish about it last year. Some Mormonite dweeb too
Forum: Recovery Board

As others have said, Hugh Nibley did attempt a rebuttal to Wife No. 19, called "Tinkling Cymbals and Sounding Brass: The Art of Telling Tales About Joseph Smith and Brigham Young." I believe there's a link to an online version of it from Ann Eliza's wikipage. I concur that it's essentially an exercise in character assassination. There are maybe a couple of valid points raised, lost i
Forum: Recovery Board